Breaking Brown

June 10, 2013

Yvette Carnell: It’s Time For Bill Cosby to Stop Giving Black Folk Condescending Advice

Yvette Carnell: It’s Time For Bill Cosby to Stop Giving Black Folk Condescending Advice

bill cosby

Years after America’s favorite dad made news for calling out black youth, Bill Cosby is still making his opinion on ideal black American virtue known. In a New York Post column, Cosby discussed everything from Mayor Bloomberg’s soda ban to parenting, but in the end, he said much of what’s wrong with America comes down to greed and apathy.

[sociallocker]As it relates to smoking and free choice advocates, Cosby makes the observation that many people who believe they are making the choice to smoke are really just addicts, saying of smokers who are sick, “They have a metal bottle and two things going up in their nose and they have a pack of cigarettes in their pocket or pocketbooks.”

Recalling a speech by Toni Morrison, Cosby shared his belief that both greed and apathy are at the core of America’s devolution:

Toni Morrison spoke at Vanderbilt University graduation last month and she was saying that money was the reason for so many deaths, so many wars and people eating the wrong foods. And it’s true, man. But when you listen to the people who are selling “feel good,” it’s greed. They couldn’t care less about us — and because we have a feeling of apathy, we don’t care either.

Then Cosby goes down a similar road he took awhile back, calling parents to account for not taking an interest in the lives of their children:

Interview some school teachers. How many parents, on parent-teacher day, actually show up? Not to Dunbar or some school where people are saying they want their child to become an engineer or philosopher or whatever else that requires one to do some homework. Go to a school where people are not doing well. How many parents show up?

He even went so far as to describe an encounter he had with a man who enjoyed living in the ‘projects.’ “Sir, there is something wrong with you wanting to stay here forever because it means as long as you’re excepting these two checks, you’re apathetic, “ scolds Cosby.

This is an old record that many black liberals, myself included, are tired of hearing, mostly because Cosby’s assessment heaps all of the blame on parents and none of the blame on government, which is partially responsible for the creation of ghettos where many of these children live. As Ta-Nehisi Coates wrote in his blog post entitled The Ghetto is Public Policy, in Chicago, black people were pariahs whom no one wanted to live around and so the housing authority turned that prejudice into government endorsed racism.

Similar stories are also noted in the book When Affirmative Action Was White, but as always, Cosby sidesteps those issues and focuses on personal responsibility, as if that’s all that matters:

There is this situation where people tend to think that we are all victims. Victim meaning somebody else is doing this to us. That’s not true. And I said this 100 times and they keep throwing back, “victim.” What they don’t understand is that I haven’t forgotten anything.

Cosby may not have forgotten anything, but he hasn’t learned anything in a long while either.  Until he’s taken a few refresher courses on how government shapes communities, it my be fitting for him to avoid wide ranging interviews with sweeping admonishments. If he can’t speak to the disparities created by government with the same scorn that he directs at the ghetto mama in the hood, then he’s not being fair, and there’s no reason we should listen.

When Bill Cosby’s ready to discuss mass incarceration or college debt, then give me a call. Until then, I don’t have the time nor energy for his unfounded contempt or old man rants. [/sociallocker]

 

 

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1,437 thoughts on “Yvette Carnell: It’s Time For Bill Cosby to Stop Giving Black Folk Condescending Advice

  1. DemondHugoBossBrown says:

    I agree, but black people are geniuses at discovery what the problems are, but where idiotic when it comes to resolving those problems, the main reason is, we ask the government what they going to do about it, but we need to ask ourselves what where going to do about it.. .

  2. Barry Burch Jr says:

    I agree.  And there are so many Bill Cosby types.  I remember an older gentlemen who would help me organize during a past campaign.  He was retired, and in his free time, he would pass out pieces of paper which said, “pull your pants up,” along with several other similar commands, to young Blacks in the community.  I knew he was coming from a good place, but there was so many other things he could have been doing that would have been many times more helpful and effective.  I stopped listening to Bill Cosby many years ago.  Unfortunately, he might as well be white.

  3. MichaelChilds says:

    Good point, pay attention Black ppl………….

  4. roylee47 says:

    As long as we keep deferring the blame for our problems on everybody else but us then our problems will continue to stay unsolved, and needless to say;unrecognized..  Just how many ways do we want the pie sliced? If none of our VIP’s spoke up then we would blame them for not caring. Yet, we claim to have a problem when some do(in this case Dr. Bill Cosby) we accuse them of “airing  our dirty laundry”.
    What’s laughable is the belief that our laundry is so well hidden that no one needs to give up it’s position. Our dirty laundry has been a public spectacle for so long it is now , and has been for quite some time. And, now it is  a public eye soar!
    How long will we continue to want our cake and eat it too wile waiting on someone to clean the dish?
    We want the federal government to step in and become the parents that we are failing to be. Not all of us, but too many of us. Our list of priorities are so way off- point  that expecting the government to fix our problems to be sitting at the top of the list is the best possible example to prove how far off  base we are.
    When you fall down you have to make the effort to get up so that someone will desire to come help you. You don’t sit there and wonder why no one is coming to your aid as expedient as you hoped they would.
    The government is not holding our kids in a room during school hours, and then letting them come home after the bell sounds. It doesn’t take all of our efforts to know where are kids are. Nobody’s asking us to be perfect at parenting, but do we honestly think we are doing the best job of parenting that we can possibly do?
    I don’t think this answer should take all this long. The answer is no. If you own a cell phone you can establish a connection either with your child’s teacher, or the school’s office. It doesn’t take long to call and ask “is my child in school today, and are they getting their school work done”? Sadly, we prepare more for the weekend of partying then we do mapping out the week. Once again not everyone, but to many. If I’m wrong then let the statistics of African-American students graduating prove me wrong.
      We can also ask our children to check in all times of the day. Is that cramping their lifestyle. too much? Well that’s why they have so much time to get into illegal activities because no one is holding them accountable for their time.
    Is the government supposed to be making these phone calls to the school, and to check on where they are? It’s time that we stop believing what we are hoping should be, and start thinking about whether what we believe is some what off base. If it should be then we need to start getting ourselves back on the right track.
    We want people to agree with us when we are wrong And furthermore, to let us go down the wrong path blindly while blaming everybody but us for making that choice. This is just not mature thinking.  Not at all!

  5. lyquidskye says:

    I have found that it much easier to focus on shortcomings and to blame folk than to actually figure out a cause.  Determining a cause and being proactive is far greater a teaching tool than demeaning and chastising.  If you continually talk down to a group of people while instilling stereotypes, not only do you help the stereotypes to exist, but you may cause folks to exist in that realm. I don’t condemn Cosby, but I am a bit worried about his delivery.  How about stopping the creation and maintenance of stereotypes and helping to change them.  It takes much more than giving a check and then talking bout what you SHOULD be doing.  Moreover, it is about reducing the variables that cause he issue ridden world that we live in.

    1. roylee47 says:

      Check out what he is doing in the northeast region with the college kids there. He’s not all talk as others would have us believe. Great comment by the way !

  6. fahlitobrigante says:

    Bill Cosby’s net worth is $350 million. Just an example of how empowerment can be done:
    Bill could purchase the Richard Allen projects in Philly that produced him (it is too late now, but just an example of something that can be used elsewhere, we have to stop neglecting the hoods) . Say if he put up $100 million, and he got investors to put up another $100 million. He could totally renovate those projects, and make them affordable ($300/month), livable, and with the opportunity to own. Make the people who live there take pride in the projects by creating a tax base, let’s say $2000/year per unit. There are 1,324 units in those projects; if everyone paid $2000 a year in taxes, that is roughly $167/month, and would $2.6 million a year in taxes ( not a lot, but nothing to sneeze at).
    Everyone who works for Richard Allen (security, maintenance, accounting) has to be a Philadelphia resident, and preferably live there themselves. Now, everyone who lives there has to open up a savings account at a bank that Mr. Cosby can own, and part of it goes to a college fund for children who come from Richard Allen who show potential. Now add an affordable grocery store and other businesses that Black people usually have to go out of town to patronize, and make them contribute too (especially by giving preference to city residents for employment and by paying a special tax for them being able to operate in our neighborhoods and profit off our spending power) and now you have an empowered community who will take pride in where they live, and when people have pride, dignity, self-esteem, and a little money saved up and able to afford to live, then we produce the kind of people we want to see. One person can change the whole dynamic of a region. Mr. Cosby, are you ready to do that instead of highlighting our issues? Create opportunities that you know everyone doesn’t have access to.

  7. fahlitobrigante says:

    Look at this in Philly:
    http://raniakhalek.com/2013/06/05/philadelphia-is-closing-23-schools-while-building-a-400-million-prison/
    Now, creating college funds for people is nice, but how about when regular schools are not going to be open to a people who have already given up on the hopes of the American dream through education, while they are even seeing that dream not visible for people who have worked for it? We are a people who, although we have great resilience, we have been broken, and we can’t keep buying into a system that broke us and continues to systematically keep us broken.

  8. GlennKrasner says:

    I would not be too hard on Mr. Cosby, as he grew up as a poor black man in South Philadelphia during the height of segregation and discrimination, and means well for all of us in society.  In addition, he is an entertainer, not a sociologist, although he does have a Phd. doctorate in education, and no less than Jerry Seinfeld and Ray Romano have called him the greatest standup comedian of all time (and he always worked clean, never blue).  So, as someone who grew up watching all of his television shows (I am 50) going back to the original “Bill Cosby Show” where he played gym teacher Chet Kincaid, and worshipped the Saturday morning cartoon, “Fat Albert and the Cosby Kids”, where I DID learn something every week, I would definitely try to reserve some respect and honor for this American icon and legend.  Glenn Krasner in the Bronx, NY

    1. DemondHugoBossBrown says:

      Actually, he grew up in the Richard Allen projects, in North Philadelphia. …..

      1. GlennKrasner says:

        DemondHugoBossBrown 
        I am sorry for my misinformation.  Thank you for the correction.  I know the man had been through a lot before he became successful.  God bless you and thank you again.  Glenn

  9. whitebl09 says:

    You and People like you are, Ms Carnell, are exactly why we are in the situation we are in. Mr. Cosby is dead on in every thing he has said. People need to be accountable for themselves. Stop blaming the government.. stop looking for help from the government. Help should start from home. Our kids don’t do well in school because the parents won’t show any level of involvement. Don’t give me the single mother excuses either because it is 2013.. when you know better you should do better and young women should be smart enough not to keep falling in those same traps now of becoming single parents before they are even adults themselves or ready to sustain a family. We need to do better as a people.

    1. whitebl09  “Stop blaming the government.. stop looking for help from the government.”
      Even if it’s true? Even if there’s a causal relationship? No, telling the truth about poverty is what I should be doing. What shouldn’t be happening is what I see here: Black people tearing into other black people to buttress their own self-esteem… with ZERO evidence to support their point of view.

      1. Val Chaney says:

        Yvette Carnell whitebl09   You’re absolutely right about that, Yvette.  Everyone deserves kindness and  compassion, regardless of their economic status.  And providing inaccurate information, or disclosing half of the facts is a disservice to every reader.   We don’t need to attack each other to provide solutions to our problems.

  10. Whitney2018 says:

    Damn, Yvette. This is the first post I actually agree with you all the way. Sometimes you tend to be biased in some of your opinion pieces, but I must say you really hint the nail on the head with this piece. Great work, but I doubt someone as narrow-minded and bitter as Cosby would care to listen. He wants to lecture all this is wrong with black America while it was a white man who murdered his son in cold blood and white America who attacked the living hell out of his wife for merely stating that America taught this murderer how to hate.

  11. prophetmario7 says:

    The truth of the matter is Bill has earned the right to speak to this community because he has indeed donated millions to educated black men.  What has Yvette done in terms of finances that really matter.  Yes writing biased articles about the social evils of the government only uncover but where is her action to our community? All of you who are wearing Bill out would feel different if some black hoodlum killed your loved one, or robbed you.  You all know the truth.  You know we do need to address our issues.  Clean up around your own front door!!!!!!!

    1. lyquidskye says:

      prophetmario7  So she can’t speak or criticize Bill because she has not contributed the same amount of money that he has?  You said sweep your own front porch, but the same could be said of Bill, I am sure.  There is not a one of us who falls short, and yes we need to do some major cleaning in our culture, I agree with you there.  But, folks have been using this tactic for eons and guess what?  It has not worked.  Please realize that focusing on stereotypes promotes more stereotypes.  Also, when you give money for scholarships and to colleges (a very good deed and I am not taking away from it in the least), guess what? You are helping those who are probably going to fight tooth and nail to make it without your help. The issue is getting to the folks that Cosby is addressing; he is talking down about them to folks who aren’t them. Now you tell me how that is going to help those who need the most.

      1. prophetmario7 says:

        Again I say what about truth. He is not talkingvdown to anyone he is exposing the issues that our people must correct if they are going to progress. It amazes me that goodblack parents talk the same way to lazy trifling children in order to let them know that certain behaviors are unacceptable. Blacks say the same thing Bill is saying in your private circles and share his sentiment when they are effected personally by another black person who is considered poor or ghetto by his or her own people. The hypocrisy sickens me. Bill may have his issues but he has not told anything but truth with the things he said. Period. The truth is some of our people don’t do a damn thing with available resources that could make life better. Truth. They steal andcrob and hate us who have.

        1. lyquidskye says:

          prophetmario7 Well that is the thing. You are actually supporting my argument here.  When parents talk to their children they are addressing specific issues that they are aware that their children have.  When Bill speaks he makes broad, sweeping generalizations that help to perpetuate stereotypes. If he wants to make a difference, then don’t speak in a media hyped forum.  Go to a group home, go to a juvenile jail, speak one on one with those who have the issues. Otherwise, it comes across as him seeing all black youth who wear sagging pants or have twists or braids as being thugs.  IJS.

    2. prophetmario7 He has earned the right to speak, but we all have the right to criticize where we see fit. No one is insulated from criticism.  And is this all about money to you? If I’m not a multi-millionaire then I have no right to write or speak?. That’s a materialistic standard, one that seems to be pervading our community.

  12. EIESOC says:

    TRUTH BE TOLD,URBAN AMERICA DON’T LIKE THE TRUTH!
    Urban America in some parts of this nation is in denial.Living under siege due to Gun Violence and burying our children has become the norm.Urban America’s lack of courage & commitment to prevent more death is proof.Urban America has a big issue when it comes to Unity.Urban America still has not caught on to the fact,that Unity is the master key that will unlock all the chains of learned helplessness & internalized oppression.Urban America is still waiting for the Calvary to save them.Not accepting that they are the Calvary and it’s way pass time to save themselves.Urban America has chosen to forget about their predecessors who by Unity, sacrifice & commitment for human & civil rights.Led to the beginning of equal rights,that Urban America benefits from today.Urban America believes we have arrived in society,truth is we haven’t.The progress that was made has stalled by Urban America.Urban America’s children’s education is lacking due to the parents and placing the blame on teachers & schools.Urban America believes they’re powerless against those who’ve convinced them there is no hope.Truth be told it’s being done by design.Urban America is giving their money to Mega churches,which do nothing for the urban communities which surround the church.This is why Urban communities have no businesses of their own.Urban America is electing local officials and not holding them accountable to address the ills of Urban communities.Urban America wont let go of suffering from the Willie Lynch syndrome.There is no trust of one another in Urban America.Urban America suffers from high unemployment & poverty,still Urban America is the biggest consumer in the nation.Urban America’s mindset is every man & woman for themselves,survival of the fittest. Never mind who gets let behind.Urban America is in it’s own way,blocking themselves from changing their conditions in Urban America.Urban America is headed in the wrong direction,is in dire need of GPS. The road is leading to a dead end.Urban America it’s time to learn to believe in yourselves again.The prisons are filling up with troubled youth & young adults and so are the grave yards.Does Urban America have a fear of change and truth.”Truth Be Told,Urban America”doesn’t like the truth………No Violence-Know Peace!Posted by http://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030

    1. roylee47 says:

      EIESOC WELL SAID,WELL SAID, WELL SAID, ENOUGH SAID!!!

      1. EIESOC says:

        roylee47 EIESOC Thank you Roylee,truth is truth!

    2. lyquidskye says:

      EIESOC A cultural issue is not solved by talking down to and degrading that culture.  It’s solved by discovering the variables that contribute to the issue and eradicating the variables.  Just a thought here, but realize that the “Urban America” as you referenced  is needed in order to create and keep jobs in many different areas of the criminal justice system and outside of that system. Just think about that for a moment.  Now if you think that talking down to a group of folks in a media heavy forum is the way to create change, then God Bless you.

      1. EIESOC says:

        lyquidskye EIESOC”YES WE CAN”!In 2008 President Obama stated “Yes We Can”.Was he just speaking about the Presidency,I think not.
        Here’s why,how many of us really believed they would witness a African American man become President of the  U.S.A. in their life time.Not many
        The message in “Yes We Can” for African Americans is this.
        Yes We Can rise to the top.
        Yes We Can free ourselves from internalized oppression & learned helplessness.
        Yes We Can reverse the “Willie Lynch Syndrome”.
        Yes We Can change our image in America’s society.
        Yes We Can become better parents.
        Yes We Can be “United” in our communities.
        Yes We Can Demand better “Education for our children.
        Yes We Can Restore black owned businesses in our communities.
        Yes We Can say no to the “Negative” messages pumped through some urban radio stations to our youth & young adults,that promote violence,sex,drugs,false riches & disrespect of women
        Yes We Can decrease the “Gun Violence” in our communities.
        Yes We Can be accountable for the status we now have in America,and take action to change what we have allowed to happen to our conditions,children & us as a whole.
        Yes We Can stand with leaders who stand for us.
        Yes We Can make our local politicians accountable for their promises,when running for office.
        Yes We Can keep Dr. Kings dream alive.
        Yes We Can promote self pride,self respect,self love & the value of life to our babies & youth.
        Yes We Can save our troubled youth & young adults,who are called the lost generation,without them where is African American’s future.
        Yes We Can love one another unconditionally.
         Yes We Can be our brothers & sisters keeper.
        Yes We Can “Keep Hope Alive”.
        Yes We Can stop going along to get along and stand for something and stop accepting anything.
        Yes We Can cause “God” said so!
        NO VIOLENCE-KNOW PEACEPosted by http://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030

        1. CarolParks says:

          EIESOC lyquidskye That’s a beautiful message! And, yes you can do anything you want! PEACE!

      2. Val Chaney says:

        lyquidskye EIESOC Every other race gets treated with courtesy, dignity and respect–but ours? Why?  Anybody talking to other immigrants like Cosby talks to and about us?  No!  If that’s the best he can do, who is listening?  At best, he’s reinforcing a negative stereotype about our race.  At worst, he condescending and telling only part of the truth–if any.  We’re better than that!  And other cultures have the same idiosyncrasies and experience the same issues, but they aren’t totally locked out of the mainstream as we have been.  It’s amazing how we’re required to be so much better at facing obstacles than other races, while we with so much less, and then also withstand the beat down by the people who should be leading us.  Misplaced hostility…Self-hate…Victimizing the victim…Let’s be fair…

        1. Val Chaney lyquidskye EIESOC “Misplaced hostility” is exactly right.

    3. JohnDgdc says:

      EIESOC  You are a poet.  You have an understanding of how to use language.  IF you are in college, find a dept. that has a Fine Arts grad. dept. You may not believe it is necessary, but it can help.  If you want to be a professional poet, I can offer some direction.  One of my students was a part of the new New York poets, and has just finished her new volume of poetry.  The only question,  and professionals are sometimes short in speech, yoy must know if this is you passion, and you must be willing to pqy the prices.  If you are serious, contact me.

      1. EIESOC says:

        JohnDgdc EIESOC Thank you for the compliment and inspiration.I just write from the heart. I’ve been told by others who feel the same as you,perhaps it’s time to give some consideration,Thank you again!

    4. bwdn2008 says:

      EIESOC I take it by Urban you mean African Americans. You know those people who do not own Corporations and have little power in, “Urban Areas.” You come off like a white person. The closest big city to me is about 27% African American, and the rest of the population is white, Hispanic, and Asian. Yet, you are focusing on the, “Urban” as if only African Americans live there. You must see success as having money and power. If so the way America was set up gave money and power to white males. Although African Americans have money, very few have power. They do not own banks, Multinational Corporations, Gold or Diamond Mines, or even Prisons. So I do not agree with your premise that those, “URBAN AMERICANS” are responsible for America’s decline or even their own decline. However, your hatred of those, “URBANITES” is noted.

      1. EIESOC says:

        bwdn2008 EIESOC You have a right to disagree,still you don’t have a right to attack me or my character.For record I’m a African American male who loves his people.Truth  is truth no matter how you slice it.I would insist that your comments not include character assassination.

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          EIESOC bwdn2008 I don’t know your character nor you and am responding to your post talking about, “URBAN AMERICANS”  when you are referring to African Americans. That is exactly what racist whites do when they want to make a point about those who live in Urban Areas and those who live outside of Urban Areas. Most Urban Areas have whites and blacks living in them not just African Americans. I am an activist who deals with school boards receiving money and not passing it on to the schools. There are slumlords who do not take care of their property. Where I live the outside areas of the property is the responsibility of the owner. If the owner does not keep up his property the city and/or county will gladly come in and fine them. Maybe that is not what happens where you live. No other race or ethnic groups hates themselves as much as African Americans. Nothing is said about what is positive about the community only negative. White folks don’t have to hate us anymore as we are doing a better job than they ever could. That is what makes it so easy for blacks to kill blacks without a second thought. It all has to do with self-hate which is a form of Mental Illness.

        2. EIESOC says:

          bwdn2008 EIESOC I don’t have time to go back and forth with you.Take your argument to those who want to listen,cause I don’t.Have a nice evening!

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          EIESOC bwdn2008 If you do not want a response do not post on a PUBLIC FORUM. Everyone is not going to agree with you especially when you come across as judgmental. If you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem! I don’t see you doing anything but complain and finger pointing. Remember that some of those fingers point back at you! You have a nice evening!

  13. roylee47 says:

    Part 1
    I’d like to make a proposal: If we can identify 99 other people who meet the description of Dr. Bill Cosby in every way that he was described here in this article in regards to him being condescending, and shedding our communities in a negative light. And, by identifying them and pointing them out to our communities; immediately thereafter our black on black crime decreases by 75 % or more. Our community housing situation, our community drug problems, our community crime, and our infants being born at an alarming rate to children unable to raise them properly all immediately drop 75% then I will switch my position, and join every body who feels that what he is saying is the root cause of all our communities demise.
      As African- Americans we house a passion for life that is not rivaled by too many other cultures. We are born to be one with nature, as well with ourselves. This is why when we survey this country and see how we are interacting with our surroundings, and with one another it’s not hard to come to the conclusion that we are out-of-sync within, and on the outside of ourselves.
    What does a mansion do for someone’s perspective on life; that makes them more of a wholesome human being? If you lived in a shack with pride, and you maintained that shacks outward, and inward appearance with pride while maintaining a dignified mindset on the inside; when  you inherit a mansion those attributes are enhanced. 
    However, if your pride, and self-esteem remain non-existent, and you don’t care about yourselves, or your neighbors around you then how does inheriting a mansion, or a new housing development change those attributes? Sorry to say it , but they don’t! How long will we fail to understand that the only  person who is more at fault for defacing the person in the mirror, and who burdens that person in the mirror with a low esteem mindset; is that person who stands outside directly in front of that mirror.

  14. KhrystleNichole says:

    I don’t understand why so-called black liberals have such an issue with what he is saying? Is it that none of what he is saying is true?? Surely you can’t say that. We all know that big brother has a hand in facilitating poverty and crime in the black community. However, we have an even larger hand in it. We are always talking about mass incarceration. Of course racism is a factor in this! However, I really don’t believe “the government” is just snatching random innocent black men off the streets and locking them up. Black people aren’t new to this country and this system. Much has changed, yet much stays the same. Therefore, we know if you are caught with “a little weed” in your pocket, you’re going to get more time than the white guy with “a lot of weed” in his pocket. How about we just stop getting caught with weed? I just use this as an example but it seems that we are also the ones killing each other over sneakers, coats, wearing the wrong color and imaginary turf. We also, know that because of racism, we have a harder time getting high-paying employment. Let’s add to that problem by dropping out of school, having too many children and not maintaining committed relationships. Is that not happening either? You may not like it that Mr. Cosby is asking blacks to hold up a mirror to look at their own reflection, but you can’t say that there isn’t any truth to what he is saying. If some black men don’t want to pull their pants up and think somebody should hire them and pay them well, and when it doesn’t happen it’s the system’s fault, then they are delusional. If some black women think it’s okay to procreate with men who are incarcerated, let them! As long as she remembers she is a black woman and because she is, even if she gets a job, she is highly likely to be paid less than her white male and white female counterparts for the same position and still be unable to support her children alone on her salary. Institutional racism is still here. Like it or not! We can fight and we should fight it until the end of time. But until that time comes when racism is eradicated (which likely will be never), it IS our responsibility to do what we can to not become victims. And yes, black people do often make themselves victims by poor choices. Poor choices affect black people long-term more than any other race. We need conversation and action about personal responsibility and government responsibility. We will never do better by hiding our heads in the sand about either issue.

    1. roylee47 says:

      KhrystleNichole You prove that our eyes are not seeing images that our brains decipher as imaginative. You are a refreshing spring in a desert that has an everlasting, and unbearable degree of heat that seems to be blocking the detection, and acknowledgement of too many of our people.
      Now, and definitely not later is the time for us to really grasp what you have made so easy to interpret. This is not an over-our-heads issue. Our heads are raised, but we just won’t open our eyes. God Bless You!

    2. Basirx says:

      Ur views are that of a horse with blinders on! It amazes me that so many African Americans, only see what main stream media shows and not the reality of america is doing purposefully to the African American men. Black incarceration which started after slavery supposedly ended, has been. Tool of the detruction of black families and other ways to forced labor upon black men for corporate entires. Remember black Wall Street where black men were jailed and killed for establishing their own community where no crime was and black businesses flourished, all came to an end when the neighboring white towns attacked with police and the govt and eradicated this peace black community.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        Yep. Know all about Black Wall Street. Fortunately,black men aren’t going to jail these days for starting their own business, that’s of course, unless you are referring to starting their own “pharmaceutical” business. Personally, I don’t get my views from main stream media. I get them from having come up on these streets and witnessing firsthand the self destruction that goes on in the black community. We have to stop using the real crimes that were committed against us in the past to excuse our own poor decisions we make today.

        1. CarolParks says:

          I agree partly with what you say. Bad choices will always lead to misery. But, in truth our Legal system is totally corrupt, especially against anyone who is poor, anyone of color including Hispanics, and others. The Prison System has become A Business for Profit only. We have so much corruption in our own Gov., we need to start from scratch. But, it is the money & the Billionaires that are keeping most of Americans down.

        2. AnitaWills says:

          KhrystleNichole That your perception and your reality. Everyone does not share your perception nor your reality. Every black person in America did not come through your community. Most people who are subjected to poverty, crime, and violence have a limited view of the world. It would be good to take a history class and learn about African American History.

        3. EIESOC says:

          AnitaWills KhrystleNichole Our history should motivate us to do better instead we talk about it and remain the same.Personally I think it’s shameful.When are we going to stop looking back and start reaching back to lift those up who need help!

        4. AnitaWills says:

          EIESOC AnitaWills KhrystleNichole When you take a history class it is always about the past. That is what History means, past events. The only people who are NOT supposed to look back are African Americans. If you studied history you would know that all African Americans were not slaves and there were African here before Columbus. History is meant to enstill pride in people about their culture, but not so in America. As soon as we start talking about slavery white folks get uncomfortable and we stop talking (don’t want massa to be uncomfortable). Yet, it is they who created that history for Africans and the history of Native Americans. They were the ones who massacred Native and took their land. Not only in America but all over the World, including Australia, Hawaii, Alaska, and Hong Kong. The belief in Manifest Destiny by Europeans has not changed. In fact them telling us to, “Pull Yourselves Up By Your Own Bootstraps” while taking money away from education, jobs, housing, and health is part of their manifest destiny. Planned Parenthood was found by Margaret Sanger, a white woman, who participated in Sterilizing Black and Native Woman. You have to know your history in order to understand how pervasive the racism is. The Prison Industrial Complex started when Slavery ended. Black males were put on Work Farms in the South for 20 years if they stole a chicken. White males have been able to commit crime after crime after crime, before the system goes after them. That is the history of America and although many laws are not on the books, they are still understood.

        5. KhrystleNichole says:

          AnitaWillsI’m not the one who needs a history lesson. The people who really need a history lesson are most likely not even reading these posts!
          Many of the people who need a history lesson read well below 12th grade
          level. As I said before, history does but so much to explain the choices
          many AAs make today. Perhaps it is their limited view of the world and
          perception that makes them continue to make poor decisions. What do we
          do about that? Pretend that it’s okay? Keep playing the violins? I
          really do tire of hearing the excuse that black people are poor and the
          system is against us as a reason why we do the things we do. Many blacks
          have come from the same poor neighborhoods and are subjected to the
          same system and yet they aren’t selling drugs to their own people,
          raping their own women, robbing their own grandmothers, dropping out of
          school and making babies that they have no means to care for. I just
          read a story the other day about a guy who has 21 kids with 14 different
          women. That’s ridiculous! So I guess we should feel sorry for him and
          those women because of our history. We have more access to information
          than ever in this country. The same people we are asking sympathy for
          because they are poor and “can’t do any better” are somehow finding a
          way to get iphones and jordans! I am not saying that this applies to ALL
          poor people because I know this does not. There are many who are trying
          to make a better way for themselves. However, we cannot deny that there
          are many who are very lost. Now if you want to say that is “my
          perception and reality” go ahead. This attitude and thinking process is
          the very reason why those blacks who have gone on to make their way out
          of the ghetto don’t come back! Why keep throwing a man a fish when he
          won’t learn how to fish for himself? And when you try to teach him, he
          scoffs at you and bites the hand that feeds him. We can keep on talking about what happened to us in the past
          to comfort those and ourselves about our current conditions and abscond
          us from guilt for neglecting our own responsibilities. Meanwhile,
          others are moving on and ahead and they will leave the “historians” to
          reminisce about the past while lying down on the cold concrete licking
          their wounds.

        6. AnitaWills says:

          EIESOC AnitaWills KhrystleNichole I am an activist in my community working to change conditions. I took the time to research African American History on my own and found that even slaves made contributions. I found free blacks who purchased slaves and freed them, and served in every war this country has had. I also found that every-time blacks made gains whites would pass laws to prevent them from succeeding (like Jim Crow). We were pushed out of the South into the Urban North and faced a different kind of prejudice. We have moved to every corner of this country trying to find jobs, education, freedom. Have you ever heard of a maze? Do you know that if you put a rat in a maze it will go crazy? That is what a ghetto is, a maze where many people feel trapped. Every City has a Social Scientists who studies the population and controls the maze. You can see that the people in Urban Areas feel trapped not physically, but psychologically. That is why they cannot help anyone because they need help. They are in need of mental health help. Anyone who is living in filth is probably depressed and maybe even suicidal. We need to help those people and not point the finger at them.

        7. EIESOC says:

          KhrystleNichole AnitaWills Bravo Khrystle!!!

        8. EIESOC says:

          AnitaWillsWHO’S FUELING THE “NEW JIM CROW”MACHINE?Are African Americans unknowingly fueling the “New Jim Crow” machine? Are troubled black male youth & young adults the new commodity in the stock market, for shareholders who have invested in Corporate Corrections prisoners for profit agenda? Can the fact that the high unemployment rate for black males,not be by coincidence?Now let’s look at why African Americans are the primary fuel for the “New Jim Crow”machine.Unemployment of black males forcing some to choose crime,in order to survive.Uneducated black males coming from dysfunctional backgrounds,who are in Gangs. Perpetrators of Gun Violence & Drug dealing in African American communities.Black children being primed in schools,who’s staff diagnose them as ADHD. Which lead to ADHD meds being prescribed,that cause serious behavior side effects,which effect their thinking process.Poverty leading young black males into male prostitution.The lack of black fathers stepping up for their children.Black women who continue to have babies by men who abandon them and the child.What about black males who are listening to those on Urban radio. Thinking they’re being schooled by them,are really fooled by them.Attraction by distraction is how the “New Jim Crow” machine is being fueled. Separation by frustration.This is all happening by design.”Oh” did I mention the lack of African Americans paying attention.Time to catch on to what’s in effect as I write this blog.That young African American’s future across the nation is in a “State Of Emergency”………….No Violence-Know Peace
          Posted byhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030 KhrystleNichole

        9. AnitaWills says:

          EIESOCAnitaWillsKhrystleNichole Harriet Tubman said; “I http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Freed thousands of http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Slaves. I could have freed thousands more, if they had known they were slaves.” This is so deep! We need to understand and acknowledge that the White Establishment sees us as slaves. Once we acknowledge that we can begin to move from that slave mentality. As a people who consume much and produce little; We are Slaves! As long as we do not own our own businesses and foster entrepreneurs in our community, we are slaves. We allow people who live outside our community to control what goes on in the community. The people who work in Urban America are using Mass Transportation to come in work, and take the money to their communities. It is our tax dollars that are used to set up businesses for white America. Yes, you pay taxes even those who do not work pay taxes, on food, clothes, through fees, everyone pays taxes. The outsiders litter the community and leave it for us to clean up. Laws are passed to protect their interest over the people who live in the community. Yet, we have to wake up and make a conscious move to free ourselves from Mental Slavery.

      2. AnitaWills says:

        Basirx Excellent Post! We need to learn our history and not see the world from our limited experience.

    3. Apoetee says:

      Sister, you are so on point here.

    4. KhrystleNichole The issue I have is that most of Cosby’s assumptions are steeped in stereotypical assumptions, not facts. Earlier today, I wrote an article on how 70% of black children are nonswimmers. Is that because Blacks are too lazy to teach their kids how to swim? That would seem to be the argument here if I’d posed the question. However, there was a time that more black children knew how to swim than white kids. That all changed when we were forbidden from swimming in public pools. That’s when the trend began. Much of what we are experiencing is directly related to public policy. You should at least acknowledge that.

      1. CarolParks says:

        NEW YORK — Nearly 60 percent of African-American children cannot swim, almost twice the figure for white children, according to a first-of-its-kind survey which USA Swimming hopes will strengthen its efforts to lower minority drowning rates and draw more blacks into the sport.
        Stark statistics underlie the initiative by the national governing body for swimming. Black children drown at a rate almost three times the overall rate. And less than 2 percent of USA Swimming’s nearly 252,000 members who swim competitively year-round are black.
        USA Swimming is teaming with an array of partners — local governments, corporations, youth and ethnic organizations — to expand learn-to-swim programs across the United States, many of them targeted at inner-city minorities. One of the key participants is black freestyle star Cullen Jones, who hopes to boost his role-model status by winning a medal this summer at the Beijing Olympics.
        USA Swimming’s motives are twofold, executive director Chuck Wielgus said.
        “It’s just the right thing to do — making an effort so every kid can be water-safe,” he said. “And quite frankly it’s about performance. We’re something of a niche sport and for us to remain relevant, considering the changing demographics of the population, it’s important we get more kids involved at the mouth of the pipeline.”
        Study surveyed nearly 1,800 children
        As part of the initiative, USA Swimming commissioned an ambitious study recently completed by five experts at the University of Memphis’ Department of Health and Sports Sciences. They surveyed 1,772 children aged 6 to 16 in six cities — two-thirds of them black or Hispanic — to gauge what factors contributed most to the minority swimming gap.
        The study found that 31 percent of the white respondents could not swim safely, compared to 58 percent of the blacks. The non-swimming rate for Hispanic children was almost as high — 56 percent — although more than twice as many Hispanics as blacks are now USA Swimming members.
        Advertise | AdChoices
        The lead researcher, Professor Richard Irwin, said one key finding was the influence of parents’ attitudes and abilities. If a parent could not swim, as was far more likely in minority families than white families, or if the parent felt swimming was dangerous, then the child was far less likely to learn how to swim.
        Irwin said this means learn-to-swim programs in minority communities should reach out to parents.
        Disparity has a long history
        The minority swimming gap has deep roots in America’s racial history. For decades during the 20th century, many pools were segregated, and relatively few were built to serve black communities.
        John Cruzat, USA Swimming’s diversity specialist, said these inequalities were compounded by a widespread misperception — fueled by flawed academic studies — that blacks’ swimming ability was compromised by an innate deficit of buoyancy.
        “There are people who still give credence to these stereotypes, even in the black and Hispanic community,” said Cruzat, who wants to break the cycle that passes negative attitudes about swimming from one black generation to another.
        “These long-held beliefs are still so potent,” he said. “If you don’t teach your children to swim, you’re putting your grandchildren at risk.”
        Cruzat was pleased by one finding in the new study — that most black and Hispanic children do not disdain swimming as a “white sport.” The study also found that swimming ability, regardless of race, increased in relation to parents’ income and education.

        1. CarolParks And you’ll see in http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/06/10/swimming-and-the-fear-factor/ that 40% of white kids can’t swim either.

        2. CarolParks says:

          Yes, I know. I think all kids should learn as early as possible to learn how to swim. It’s a lifesaver, and too many children die from drowning. Even adults, everyone needs this skill. And it’s so much fun, & healthy I think all kids would really enjoy swimming.

  15. roylee47 says:

    Part 2
    Take a minute and examine this 
    The corporate community 20-30 years ago used to operate on a 5-day business week. No Saturday banking, and many businesses closed on the weekend. They decided between that time and now to go from that 5-day to first a 6-day banking to now 7 -day banking. They had to change to meet the business trends that most corporations adopted in order to make profits on the weekend as well as during the week.
    Our community 20-30 years ago worked hard to maintain our businesses mainly Monday thru Friday We owned more businesses, but still not as many as we owned surprisingly enough before desegregation.. And, on the weekend it was time to get our party on to release all the stress , and the tension that we endured during the work week that involved having to deal with ridiculous discrimination, and in many cases unfair work promotions where we were bypassed, or not even considered for the obvious reasons.Not all of us but a large percentage of us experienced this every week even after desegregation.
    On the weekend we get dressed to the nines and head to where ever our favorite spots were.When the corporate world moved to six-day banking we didn’t change our 7-day routines, and when they went to a 7-day business banking we still haven’t changed
    .We still go out, and donate heavily to those corporations that own the patents for: Johnnie Walker, Sshmirnoff,(if spelled wrong excuse me), and all of the other spirits, and wines while those corporations instead of investing any of those dollars back into our communities other than to put ads on billboards to remind us who to come and donate to on all the weekends to come.
    These are the entities, and the people who we should be pressuring to invest those hard earned dollars back into our communities to improve our living conditions, and keep our schools open, and competitive. But NOOOOO, we want to take aim at Dr Bill Cosby, who could live in his homes with the money he earned by hard work, and dedication, and not care at all. Because he cares enough to see problems that we have, and decides to speak on it we in turn show our appreciation by lashing out. Is it any wonder why many others of his stature stand afar?. 
    Even if he addressed our problems in “Glenda The good Witch’s” voice we would still take offense to what he said because beneath it all we know that there is much truth to what he says,. It’s just so much easier to point the finger at Dr. Bill Cosby then pointing it at the real culprit: the person outside of the mirror pointing at the person inside of the mirror.
    May God help us all if we don’t see the need to change, and then make that change!

    1. CarolParks says:

      Brilliant post! Thanks for writing so eloquently. There is much truth in what you say.

    2. AnitaWills says:

      roylee47 So True! There is a lot of truth to what Cosby is saying! Excellent Post. I was raised in a community where people like my father worked during the day and ran their own business. There were not a lot of blacks in our community but we had black businesses, Doctors, Lawyers, and even a black hospital. The men worked in the Mill and many used the Mill money to open a business. The store we shopped at, restaurants we ate at, bars we went to, barber shop all were owned by black folks. Many of the children of these blacks grew up went to college and left the community. When the Mill closed down the people left were those who did not have the education or wherewithal to leave. It was a no brainier back then and should be now.

  16. bwdn2008 says:

    What I notice about Bill Cosby is he quotes no statistics. He mentions parents not going to schools, as if he did a study and is an authority. He often talks about poor children wearing expensive Tennis shoes as if he did a study on it. In reality he gets his information from the same place white racists get theirs from Main Stream Media. I doubt that he has gone to a school or walked through a poor neighborhood to actually see what is going on. Bill Cosby is an entertainer, not a Social Scientist or even Historian. His interest is not in helping people make it but criticizing those who do not make it. I am more interested in what Harry Belafonte, Sidney Poiter, Cornell West, Dr. Frances Cress Welsing, or even Tavis Smiley has to say about Social Issues than Bill Cosby. I have written several books going back to Colonial Virginia, where they made laws separating the races. The passed laws requiring blacks to carry papers whether they were slave or free, in the 1700’s. Those laws are not longer on the books, but they are understood. If you do not have identification on you and you are African American, they can hold you for 72 hours. Bill Cosby is safe as long as the whites he deals with know he is Bill Cosby. As a black man walking in certain neighborhoods in America he is just another Negro. Someone stated that we should EXPECT to be treated differently than whites and that is insanity. Why would I expect to be treated any differently than any other citizen in my OWN Country? Bill Cosby is free to say whatever he wants and I am free to disagree with him. Having money does not him or anyone else a moral authority. For that matter than George Bush, Dick Cheney, Romney and all the other old white dudes who are wealthy, should be moral authorities. Bill Cosby allowed his show to be shown in South Africa when everyone else was boycotting (during Apartheid). That is why Harry Belafonte and Sidney Poitier fell out with him. Some of his shows are entertaining, but when he is panning for the White Racist Society, he is just another Negro who sold out.

    1. prophetmario7 says:

      While I respect what you have said in part, as well as your accomplishments, you are forgetting and overlooking the fact that Bill and his wife were donating Millions of dollars to black colleges for underserved, disenfranchised, underprivileged and poor students before Oprah ever did it. I don’t recall ever seeimg Sydney or Harry donating I money to the cause. Lets be honest in that what he has said about our community is true. None of you critics are acknowledging that there are black lazy ass folk taking our money and circumventimg the system and its wrong. We can sit all day long and talk about white racist but how many times have we seen our own people despise help and education and prefer handouts?

      1. bwdn2008 says:

        prophetmario7 You don’t see it because the media does not report it. Most of the wealthy who donate are getting tax breaks, so yes you do hear about Cosby donating. Not only does Belafonte have a foundation he shows up and participates with folks. Had Sidney and Harry not been so vocal about the boycotting of South Africa, they too would have been awarded as Bill Cosby has been. That is what we do not look at and ignore. All money is not good money!

        1. prophetmario7 says:

          Poimt taken. However you fail to deal with his trutjs. Comimg from a family of educators and working in the community and within my own city I cam tell you he is not wrong. Our black community still does not want to acknowledge when we see this very thing Bill is talking about IN PUBLIC we laugh, make movies and do stand up. We shake our heads, move to white communities with better schools. But he has to shut up when the truth is we can do better and it is NOT ALL THE GOVERNMENTS FAULT. I realize the war on drugs and incarceration rates are horrible for our people but what happen to keep your behind clean. Many of the choices our people make are because other black folk play the roles of housewives and whores and there we have it. So deal witj his truths before you shut him down.

        2. bwdn2008 says:

          prophetmario7 Just because I disagree with him does not mean I want him to shut up! This is why I am responding to the postings to keep the conversation going. He should not be shut down because he is the reason we are on this board talking. I am pointing out to folks on the board that he is not perfect just because he has a lot of money. I see the schools too and the parents who are drugged out and grandparents raising grandchildren. Yet this was foretold when the crack epidemic hit and no one paid attention. Pretty soon there will be no where to run.

      2. JohnDgdc says:

        prophetmario7 You need to know more about Harry B before you  judge.

        1. prophetmario7 says:

          First of all I am not judging anyone and if I am what am I doing differently from those judging Bill? I didn’t say any derogatory about Harry B so be clear about that. Also this is not about judging anyone. We are discussing issue in out community so drop the scapegoat phrase judging.

      3. prophetmario7You can appreciate his work and  philanthropy while still acknowledging that his critiques are problematic. And again, what “black lazy ass folk”? I’ve noted this statistic before, but blacks comprise 22 percent of the poor, but blacks only take
        in 14 percent of government benefits. Conversely,  whites make up 42
        percent of the poor , but take in a disproportionate 69 percent of
        government benefits.

    2. whitebl09 says:

      bwdn2008 Cosby might not be giving specifics as far as statistics are concerned but I’d be willing to vouch for what he is saying. I come from a family of educators. The only times parents of troubled kids come to the schools are when there are discipline problems and they are being sent home. Usually the parents who are involved are the students who are doing well.. which is the reason they are probably doing well in the first place. You are also overlooking the fact that Cosby has done just as much if not more than the people you have named it just is not publicized in the same way as a Smiley or West who are in the business to help but to also profit from their efforts as well. Cosby only wants to see his people have a sense of pride in themselves. As far as being treated differently in our own country… let’s be honest, no one wants this. But this is the reality we face, you can’t walk around naive to the fact. We as responsible Black adults must educate our kids on this so they can be prepared until we get to a point where everyone is treated fairly. But if you walk around with your head down thinking you can get away with something wrong.. or only deserve a slap on the wrist because your white counterpart got away with just a slap on the wrist.. then you have the wrong mindset to begin with and you are setting yourself up for failure.

      1. bwdn2008 says:

        whitebl09 bwdn2008 It is all a matter of perspective and that is yours while I have my own. My family is well educated and have accomplished many things since the Revolutionary War when my ancestors fought against the British. After the war the whites turned on the blacks who fought and believed that slavery would end. The land that free blacks were awarded after the Revolutionary War, was encroached on by whites. All of this was done after laws were changed favoring whites. Don’t forget, we are a Nation of Laws!  My ancestors fought in the War of 1812 and the Civil War, always with the hope of change. What happened is that the Whites in every generation made laws which allowed them to take away the gains African Americans made, sometimes with our help. It is so pervasive that we believe that our own people are not worth saving. That is sad!  You make accusations against blacks as if there are no lazy whites, and that is wrong. If we are equal than you should look at all races equally. We know that whites are drug addicts, just as there are black drug addicts. Yet, because the media focuses on African Americans who are addicts, and they are more visible, they are your focus. The white Meth addict is not someone you will see on your evening news and you should be asking why. The murders of the children in Connecticut, Movie goers in Colorado, the murders and shooting of Gabby Gifford in Arizona, and the Oklahoma City Bombing were all done by White Males. So what does that make Whites? Why are African Americans afraid to call out whites whose privilege allows them to commit crime after crime after crime? Yet will call each other out for being lazy (which is a term white slave owners used to demean their property). In actuality the hardest working people in America are in the fields picking crops, or doing some other service type job. Yet many are just barely making it. That is the truth the news does not report. I believe that African Americans do not worship God, but worship Whites and their Materialistic views. That is why anyone who has money is some kind of moral authority.

        1. whitebl09 says:

          bwdn2008 whitebl09 Yea but that was hundreds of years ago. Whites got away with stealing land from us.. enslaving us.. subjecting us to racism because we were uneducated. At the time it was at no fault of our own though. Over the years we have made strides to try to catch up and have made advances in many fields.. lawyers, doctors, first black President etc. I didn’t say there were no lazy whites, but we are not talking about what is wrong with the white community, we are talking about what is wrong with our community. We have a tendency to deflect the issues instead of addressing things we can control right now. We can start robotics groups in the hood. We can tutor. We can mentor. We can offer alternatives other than rap and sports such as STEM careers. We were already behind as a people because we had everything robbed from us as you so eloquently stated so that in itself should be an obvious indicator that we must work harder if we intend to catch up because we are trying to make up for lost time. Like I said, we all know there is white privilege letting them get away with crimes. But instead of committing the crimes and asking to be treated like them (because it is against the law and whenever you break the law your fate is in the judges hands) how about let’s not break any laws young men and women and raise up prosecutors, lawyers and judges and put the law into our own hands. That’s the only way we can begin to influence change.. to shift the demographic, not continue to blame something years ago that has no real effect on today.

        2. bwdn2008 says:

          whitebl09 bwdn2008 That is where you and I have different perspectives. I find it odd that black folks, who claim to be Christian can mourn the death Christ but not see that recent events affect us. I am assuming that you are an African American and not a poser (a white person pretending to give a black perspective). I am connected to my past because the same racist belief that allowed whites to steal Native lands and enslave Africans continue to this day. Even back then there were blacks who worked with whites against the interest of their own people. Europeans have only been in the Americas for 400 years as opposed to 14,000 years of occupation by Native Americans. So when you say that was a long time ago, it does not register with me. When you say things have changed, yes there are surface changes which have not changed the racist mentality of whites who target our communities. Right now there is a gentrification process going on in an Urban Area near me, so the police come in make arrest, shot young black men, and allow drugs and guns in the community. This has been going on since the Civil Rights Movement and the formation of the Black Panthers. Little has changed because they always have a part of the black community who say,  “Things Have Changed.” If you believe things have changed then maybe you are not seeing what I see or talking to who I am talking to. Whenever I see Cosby speaking against his own people to the Media, I know that things have not changed. IMHO!

  17. Johnnie R Evans Sr says:

    why mr. cosby not saying these things in he hey day………. when his show was on t v

    1. reneegede says:

      Johnnie R Evans Sr Uhm. He did. And black folks got smart with him then, too. I broke him off a piece about “C’mon People.” Yet … that was awhile back and we’re still discussing this? wtf?! 4real4real?

  18. MichaelChilds says:

    Their’s always Bad in good

  19. KimberlyWhitehead says:

    I think folks are missing the BIGGER PICTURE of what Dr. Cosby is saying….your environment and background DO NOT HAVE TO DICTATE how you are represented to the world.  My parents were working class, but my mother DEMANDED that you answer the telephone correctly, she DEMANDED that we do not use slang in our home, we said Yes/no ma’am/sir…teaching manner and giving your child home training is FREE and does not cost a dime!  Being cautious of what you say and do in front of your child, from the TV shows you watch to the music you listen to, to the people you have in contact with YOUR CHILD(REN).  For Dr. Cosby, $$$$ never really played a factor.  He didn’t grow up with it – his beef with the Black community is that we have too many parents NOT raising children….I do understand that parents today gotta work 2nd shift, 3rd shift, 2 or 3 jobs just to make ends meet, but you can instill values and morals in your child – again, this is FREE…so why are so many folks upset about what Dr. Cosby said?  I guess the truth hurts.

  20. EIESOC says:

    Maybe Mr.B Cosby is tellin us this>”OUR TIME”I was inspired to write this blog after listening to President Obama accept his nomination for reelection this November.
    This blog is not to meant offend anyone,who is not African American.
    Hopefully it will inspire others who are not African Americans,and need a “Wake Up”!
    African Americans this is our time,we’ve had 4yrs to catch on to the fact that this is “Our Time”.
    Should God bless us with 4 more years under our current President.Lets not blow it!It’s time to free ourselves from ourselves.We’ve been waiting far too long for the opportunity we now have.We must capitalize on President Obama being in the “White House”.We’ve been praying and asking God to help us,well God has delivered.Now it’s up to us to not take God’s Grace & Mercy for granted.It’s time to better educate ourselves and better educate our children,The first family is living in the house,they said we would never occupy.It’s the proof of what we can do as African Americans.There are no more excuses we can make for our conditions.We now have a leader who when he speaks is telling us how to lift up ourselves to the level we need to be.Yes he is the President of the USA,not the president of Black America.Still we can achieve what others believe we can’t.Black men it’s time to change our mindsets about ourselves,our children & Black women.Black woman its time to change your mindset about your children & Black men.Black family values & unity,must be a priority.It’s time to stop being led astray by false prophets on Sunday morning.God is watching and waiting for us to catch on to the fact that if we really want change,that change begins with us.God has more patience than we could ever imagine.How much longer shall we choose to procrastinate and believe someone else is going to do it for us.Our Troubled youth & young adults are being led to the grave & prison by those who know,that this is “Our Time”.Our children’s education is being sabotaged by those who know that education is the key to our “Rise”as African Americans.Education will bring us where we need to be economically.Our spirituality needs a major overhaul.Some of us are giving their money to Churches instead of investing in their community.This type of foolishness needs to stop.One of the reasons we don’t have as many black owned businesses as we should, is because we’re not investing in our communities.Instead we have allowed others to profit in our communities,we don’t have to stand for nor go along with it.This mindset of every bodies angry at each needs to stop,instead lets begin the healing process of ourselves.We are the only race that’s stingy with each other,The more we share,the more we Rise.”Our Time” maybe the only chance get to “Rise” as a people. Self help is the best help.Our Rise is not to oppress others,it’s to bring us to the level we can and need to be as African Americans in America.
    No Violence-Know Peace!Posted by http://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030

    1. CarolParks says:

      Loved your post “Our Time”. Go get it! 🙂

  21. reneegede says:

    That American ghettos were built by government is true. And the “American Euro-Jews” used to live in them, especially in the Bronx of NYC.
    That black folks went into those ghettos that the Jews ran from and tore them down instead of leveraging what they had to build a better world and better life for themselves is not the government’s calling.
    That, indeed, is the calling of black families who live in those “old Jew-owned ghettos” to take ownership and pride in the little they have and use it as leverage to build a future for themselves and their children.
    That’s what Pres Obama meant about black folks making excuses. They need to stop. 4reals.
    We aren’t hard-wired to be that stupid and keep licking up white folks ‘vomit’ in the form of poverty and then crying that it’s all we have to eat. THAT is a lie straight from the pits of hayell where it came from.
    And stop teaching your children to come out of school to look for “jobs.” Teach them to find a job long enough to learn to open a business in that “ghetto” and become a job creator. Black folks ain’t never been this danged stupid and weak. Since when did we get here?
    WE lived in poverty and didn’t use it for an excuse. My sisters and I are the first in our family to graduate from college — and we didn’t have jack by way of material substance, along with plenty of drugs, liquor, and wayward men that we could have used as leverage to do the wrong thing, yet we chose to do right by ourselves. With NOTHING to start with, not even so much as a ROLE MODEL in our families or our hoods.

    Done deal. Sink or swim, after Obama is no longer in office and Cosby is dead and gone, if black folks are still talking this ish in another 40 years … whose “fault” will it be then?
    I AM a black liberal (the Tea Party and the GOP, as far as I’m concerned, can go straight to the hayell Maxine Waters told them to go to in the first place) and I’m proud of being a black liberal even though I am not a Party loyalist when it comes to Democrats; and I say this is a bunch of BS Incarnate.
    Cosby has said some things that made me squirm in the past, but he is right. This time. Black folks could really stand to take a lesson from the Black Muslims. Seriously.
    All of them aren’t “rich” or well-endowed with government assistance or programs or loads of “we came to get tax money to make black folks stop shooting each other” platitudes.
    They depend on each other and still manage to make it through all of this mess white folks have jacked Black America with. Listen. And learn from them.

    1. bwdn2008 says:

      reneegede Read about the migration of blacks from the south to Northern Cities. They left the south to escape Jim Crow, with it’s racism, forced slavery and Lynchings. Just because there was a Civil War did not mean racism ended. I wish black folks knew how to research and not just repeat what they are told. There was a great migration of blacks to the North, who were seeking employment and a better life. They settled in cities that were inhabited by Irish, Italians, and Jews, and for the first time lived with whites. It was when the suburbs were being built for whites that blacks were left in the Ghettos. Do you know what Zoning Laws are and how they affected blacks? Those laws were aimed at blacks who allowed their relatives from the south to live with them. Cities passed zoning laws stating that only one family or a certain amount of people could live in a house or apartment. Zoning laws also stated which communities blacks could and could not live in. I am getting the feeling that some of you on here are not African American, but, “Posers.” I do not believe that in 2013 we are so uninformed about our own history. If you are not white than you should be offended since Cosby is talking about YOU!

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        Why do we keep trying to explain away our present condition by rehashing the events of the past? No one is saying racism does not exist.no one is saying racism has not had a long-term negative affect on the African American community. However, the issue at hand today is not zoning laws and wrongful incarceration. The issue is that we don’t take what we do have and improve upon it. Just because you’re poor, that’s not an excuse to be filthy. Why is there broken glass and trash on your streets? Being poor is no excuse to be neglectful. Why are your children hanging out in the streets at 11 o’ clock at night being noisy, disrespectful and destructive? Tell me this doesn’t happen. Being poor doesn’t make you careless. Why are black women up in the abortion clinic having multiple abortions? Let me tell you, I’ve seen black people go buy an outfit to wear to the club and ask to borrow soap to wash their arse. Black people make their own ghettos now. When you sell crack to your neighbor’s children you destroy your own community. That’s not the white man, it’s YOU!

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          KhrystleNichole If you are not a Poser and are indeed African American, Cosby was talking to you. He was talking to every black person that is not in his and Oprah Winfreys circle. He was talking about the wealthy rappers and blacks who cannot form a sentence. Yes he was talking about YOU! The funny part is how you join in to point the finger as if he is talking to everyone but you (You can ignore this if you are a Poser).  In the first place no one in my neighborhood has children doing what you are talking about. You should be aware of your audience when you are making a point. We don’t all live in your neighborhood nor see what you see. I am defending my people knowing that they are targeted and used as an excuse for what is wrong in America. The issue is Wrongful Incarceration and Gentrification at least in my part of the country. Since I don’t know where you live or what you are experiencing I cannot speak for you. Nor should you speak for me about what the issues are in my community. There are people with money who are filthy but you only see blacks as filthy, which again begs the question. Are you African American?  I have been around white folks, Asians, and Hispanics, some who are well educated and others who are not. There are filthy people in every group. But you will not hear an Asian, Hispanic, or White person get on National TV or Social Media and talk against their own group. Only Negroes do that because we are taught to hate and despise ourselves and each other. Let those who have eyes see; Let those who have ears hear!
          By the way have you heard of Ted Bundy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Timothy McVey, Gerald Loughner, James Holmes, Adam Lanza, Unibomber, Green River Killer, or John Wayne Gacy? They are some of the white males who are Serial and Mass Killers. You know those whites that some Negroes love to worship and emulate!

        2. KhrystleNichole says:

          Bwdn2008, understand that when I say “you”‘, I don’t mean YOU personally. I wasn’t talking about your specific neighborhood. I was simple asking why is it that this behavior is so prevalent in many of our black communities? Are you saying that you have never witnessed this behavior in the black community? I’m not concerned with filthy Asians or Hispanics so much since they take care of their own and still outperform African Americans in academics and economics when you minus language barriers and adjust for higher education attainment. We’re concerned about blacks talking about our issue on national television as if its a secret. That’s the problem! It’s not a secret! It’s downright embarrassing. And we are responsible for our own embarrassment. If we are so ashamed of exposing our dirty laundry, then maybe we should be ashamed every time we show up on Maury, or every time we end up on You Tube or the news engaged in a brawl in the mall or nail salon.

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          KhrystleNichole I don’t watch Maury nor do I go to Nail shops. I do not participate in situations that degrade us as a people, nor do I point the finger at people who are caught in hopeless situations. Have you heard of a slum lord? They own property and make money off of poor depressed, deprived people; black, white, and Hispanic. I am not separating my people from others because that is what the white man wants to do, divide and conquer. I see schools where there are no books and there are more police than teachers. What have the children done to deserve that treatment? What person in their right mind would point the finger at children and say, “You are the Problem?” The fact that you believe every race is more intelligent than blacks manifest itself. If you saw a black child achieving it would be unacceptable to you. Yet there are many who did achieve and came out of the Ghettos you speak of, including Bill Cosby. We were raised in a Black Community where there were Middle Class, Wealthy, and poor people. Some of those poor people are educated, Doctor’s, Lawyers, and Educators. Our community helped those who were less fortunate and did not look down or despise them as if they were the, “Other.”  That is why I empathize with the plight of those caught in the Ghetto and with that mentality. There but for the Grace of God Go I…,

        4. KhrystleNichole says:

          Bwdn2008, it seems that you look but do not see and you hear but do not listen. I think you are caught up with trying to be right and you failing to read or even think about what others are really saying. At no time did I say I believe every race is more intelligent than blacks. I was speaking on better performance which is not necessarily the result of more intelligence but the result of more effort. It’s really elementary. White privilege+effort=success. White privlege-effort=success. African American+effort=possible success. AA-effort=failure. Perhaps you should watch Maury or visit a nail shop. Maybe you wiil then see that the self destruction is real.

        5. bwdn2008 says:

          KhrystleNichole Yes. You are the You Cosby is talking about. You don’t have to say you believe someone is less intelligent it is your implication. Do you know what an implication is? The people you and Bill Cosby describe are not intelligent nor do they have self awareness. I am not going to a nail shop or watching Maury to find out what black folks are about. They are doing what they need to do to get ratings and customers. That is time better spent on reading a good book or learning history. Maybe Bill is right about some of us! You have allowed the white media to form your opinion when you should be trying to find out why people behave the way they do. There are poor nasty whites throughout the US, living in Trailer Parks, and having babies with their daddies and brothers. African Americans are expected to do better than whites who have all of the privilege. You have no idea what is going on behind the scenes here in AmeriKKKa, except for where you live. Whatever is not in your reality does not exist which begs the question, where do you live? You should travel get out and experience an environment other than the one you are in. You can ignore this if you are a poser (a white person posing pretending to be African American). 

          Now that is Real Talk!

        6. JohnDgdc says:

          KhrystleNichole Are you Bill Cosby’s aka?

        7. roylee47 says:

          bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole Just a note here. There are intelligent people that are described here. Drug dealers are not all off the street. There are many with college degrees that have made the wrong choice, and continue to make wrong choices. And, they are African-American!
          Unintelligent people and  intelligent people are mutually exclusive until they are related by bad decison making.

        8. KhrystleNicholeBecause ghettos are created by public policy, not attitudes.
          Seehttp://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/05/the-ghetto-is-public-policy/275456/

    2. KhrystleNichole says:

      Now that’s real talk!

    3. Val Chaney says:

      reneegede And don’t forget racism is very real, and it is NOT just a myth. No one feeds their family with just half of what they need.  Blacks are discriminated against in every area of our society, and locked out of the mainstream.  That’s really what we as a people should be crying out against loudly!  When African American professionals find it difficult to earn fairly, what do you think the middle class and poor can expect? Don’t fool yourselves into thinking we have arrived.  The economic survival game is still totally unfair.

    4. roylee47 says:

      reneegede So elequently said, and so very, very powerful and true. 
      The same point I was trying to make. Sometimes a person can speak a sentence, or a paragraph, and we get fixed on word or phrase, and take the whole point out of context. Or, we deflect by saying that the person’s tone turned us off. 
      Whether I scream the door is locked, or sing it as soulful as Luther Van Dross; the door is locked! End of story!

  22. Apoetee says:

    That might be your feeling but ” Blacks” do not need to be dependent on the govnment or any other race of people to teach their children to be decent human beings.
    Being poor is absolutely no excuse for being indignant, evil, self hating, abusers of young , irresponsible, uneducated or haing babies just because you can produce them!
    Stop hating on Bill for loving us enough to tell the truth!

    1. ApoeteeSource data which demonstrates that blacks are ‘more dependent’ than other races….. blacks comprise 22 percent of the poor, but blacks only take
      in 14 percent of government benefits. Conversely,  whites make up 42
      percent of the poor , but take in a disproportionate 69 percent of
      government benefits.

  23. JohnDgdc says:

    Prof. ,  I still respect Dr. Cosby.  He has earned our respect.  He did things that no one else did. I know you agree.  He is speaking from his generation, a generation compromised by many things–desegregation, racism, Jim Crow, Hollywood, the acceptance of previous taboos: single parenthood, gang culture, COINTELPRO, loss of respect for education/, male need for respect, earned or  unearned and more.  The issue is more complicated than most are willing to acknowledge or are, more importantly, qualified (education, experience, age, perspective, properly financed) to assess and evaluate.  This is not a simple issue, but he sounds just like my Momma.  I am so grateful that though we lived modestly, she instilled middle class values in both my sister and me.  Those he is speaking to need interventions.  Only community peer pressure (through organizations) can do this.  anyone willing to fund/help with grants as a pilot project?

    1. bwdn2008 says:

      JohnDgdc I respect him too! He was raised in Philadelphia and I was raised about 30 miles away. The first Album I heard by Bill Cosby was a Blue Album (just barely suitable to listen to), he was talking to God and then said, “God Please don’t Pee on Me.”  He was right up there with Red Foxx back then. Yes, we were raised in a Middle Class home where my dad worked and my mother stayed home. Our community had poor people, most of whom attended church. The churches helped the families find jobs and fed the children. Most of the poor children in our community grew up to be professionals, Educators, Doctors, Lawyers, and even excelled at sports. That is what made the difference the community cared. We were not allowed to say anything bad about people who were struggling to make it. I respect Dr. Cosby but on this I disagree with his pointing the finger at people when any of us could be in that situation. There were many promising young men who were in the Vietnam War and came home damaged. They suffer from PTSD or were addicted to Drugs. There are many extenuating circumstances in which people find themselves and there use to be help. It seems to me that a lot of people in America, black and white, need mental health help. I don’t want to point my finger at them I want to know what can I do to help besides talk about them!

      1. JohnDgdc says:

        bwdn2008 JohnDgdc Did you notice my plea for help?  Each of us must do what we can in our communities.  I am a pastor and rtired college professor.  In addition to my church duties, I tutor for free.  I was raised in the south, and we try to help others.  BUT there were community people and organizations that regulated.  Bill’s community is an extended one.  We need his voice too.

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          JohnDgdc bwdn2008 Yes I agree with that. We need all of the voices including those who have no voice. As a pastor you know that Jesus did not and would not abide what is going on here in America. The Jews wrote about watching as their people were taken away and not speaking up. When they came for those who did not speak up, there was nobody left to speak up for them. It is not just poor blacks who are being denigrated, it is blacks as a whole because they lump us altogether. That is what some folks on this board are missing.

        2. Val Chaney says:

          bwdn2008 JohnDgdc  You’re so right about that bwdn2008. Many who are educated have totally missed the point.  We are prepared to serve those in need–not to nuy more and get more stuff!   If we become successful and we forget our purpose for living, then what good are we?  If someone can’t help you, then maybe you should be helping them.  All of us are God’s creation.

  24. Val Chaney says:

    Two months ago, I was on the Internet reading an essay that Bill Cosby had supposedly written.  It was full of inaccuracies, and extremely condescending to African Americans.  It blamed the victims for their poverty and living conditions.  Earlier, I had read Mr. Cosby’s biography, and found it hard to believe that Cosby–a man who also experienced and shared problems commonly associated with poverty and race–could be so harsh and insensitive.  So I wrote about the cruel remarks he had made in his essay.  Turns out, when readers checked out the essay, they found out that Mr. Cosby himself never wrote it!  And many articles penned  in his name may not be his own.  Frankly, I don’t believe Mr. Cosby would discuss problems without also offering solutions.  His beliefs and values are the same as members of his fraternity, and many others who are dedicated to community service.  Mr. Cosby supports the right causes, and  has consistently demonstrated genuine concern for others.  But whoever is writing in his name is totally misguided, inaccurate and obnoxious, and they need to stop promoting negative racial stereotypes.

    1. roylee47 says:

      Val Chaney You have done what many never follow-up and do. You followed the stream to the source. Many are drawn to sensationalim, and not the truth. If it isn’t damaging, or if it isn’t tearing the other person a new one we don’t lend our full attention.For example House Wives Of Atlanta, Love , and Hip Hop etc…!
      the subtel truth desrves just as much attention since it’s educational value is either equal, or it supercedes! 
      Bill Cosby is not a perfect prson, but he has told pure truth!

  25. CarolParks says:

    I love Bill Cosby, and believe he is speaking from his heart, & is trying to help people.

    1. bwdn2008 says:

      CarolParks Just because some people disagree with him does not mean we don’t love him. There is nothing wrong with saying I disagree with a point Cosby is making while still agreeing he is an icon in our community. It is not about love or hate we are having an open discussion which is what he wanted us to do.

      1. CarolParks says:

        bwdn2008 CarolParks I believe the Title of the article, along with the content really is disparaging of Mr. Cosby, and is disrespectful.  It is fine to disagree with his points or opinions, but this article to me shows more of a anger towards him. I think he makes great points about smoking, drugs, gangs, etc. And really the points he makes; even though they are aimed at the AA community; really applies to all youth everywhere. He uses common sense which I really love and respect. Our youth are our most important assest, and we need to show them the way.

  26. StephanieMissLady says:

    He isn’t lying at all. Get off of him.

  27. AfoteyAnnum says:

    Bill Cosby is telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing BUT the truth so help him God.
    Black folks need to RECOGNIZE the external factors that plague us, but @ the same time empower themselves in order to bring about a sort of immunity to those challenges.
    Cosby is 1000% correct in his assessment. We as a people are completely dysfunctional.

    1. AfoteyAnnum “Black folks need to RECOGNIZE the external factors that plague us”
      What “immunity” is there from structural inequality? Are you saying we should try to find a ‘workaround'”

  28. roylee47 says:

    An unwritten rule in healthy conversations where even though we don’t agree we don’t sit in the chair labled most right all of the time…even when the music stops.
    What is the difference of being right, and most right? If you paused to think about it you’re already wrong. There is know difference.
    If two people make a right turn they can argue who made the turn at the right degree, but in the end doesit matter? The objective was to make the right turn, and not hit any one, or have an accident in the process. Only the perfect people will bother to take the time to make this debate.
    But that brings the next question to the table. Who are the perfect people? Once again if you paused to check whether you qualify, or you should receive honorable mention then you are not one of them.
    Okay to the point, there are some of us within the African-American population that can never be wrong on anything. What this really means is:” you can’t handle the truth”. Even when you find out that your own words convict you; you still go into denial. 
    Until you own imperfection you can never strive towards perfection! No! You will never be perfect. As African-Americans we have  a real issue being able to agree, and respectfully disagree AT THE SAME TIME! Shooting down someone else’s point to make yours right many times causes us to miss the entire truth, or gaining additional parts of the truth. Truth is not a property that anyone can claim ownership.  
    The wording etched in stone is not: “one mouth:one truth”.If you believe this than you probably don’t acknowledge that fractions exist. 
    Our communication lines within our communities continues to suffer for this mani reason. We can’t co-agree. Only if one is right, and one is wrong can some of us feel that the truth was reached. We can pull from whatever family history, or who we know that is supposed to make us eligible to claim “the most right ” status.

  29. EIESOC says:

    Pardon the title no disrespect meant to anyone in this forum>PROS & CONS,INTELLECTUAL BULLSHIT! WHAT ABOUT ACCOUNTABILITY?While we’ve listen to the pros & cons of why our youth & young adults are slaughtering each other.Their death toll still rises.We’ve heard don’t blame this or that for the cause of rampant “Gun Violence” in Americas inner city communities.Intellectual scholars who say education and knowledge of self is a solution,spirituality & love another.Mean while the shootings continue to escalate as the body count rises and the prison population grows.I’ve heard hip hop is a art not a influence,though hip hop artists should be held accountable for their negative lyrics about African American women,drugs & guns.Sounds kinda like a mixed message to me.Where’s the accountability for what’s happening to our youth & young adults.It’s time to tell ourselves the truth about how we’ve failed our youth & young adults.We failed in our communities,as well as our schools,allowing our advancement in society,to slip away due the failure to nurture and staying consistent in the advancement of our children’s future.We’ve failed in not placing principals before personalities.We’ve failed to keep black businesses in our communities.Complacency has become our norm.Failure to admit that unity is our strength,due to selfishness & individual stardom.We have allowed fear to dictate our actions in our communities,still we cry & complain about stop & frisk policies.When we live in communities filled with guns! Accountability for what is happening to our youth & young seems to be like kryptonite to us.Until we start to account for ourselves,don’t complain about our conditions in our communities….NO VIOLENCE-KNOW PEACE!   Posted by http://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030

  30. EIESOC says:

    Apoetee Great poem first of all,may I share it on EIE-SOC’s FB page?

    1. Apoetee says:

      Yes, please do share the gift God has given me! Thank you- God bless, you

      1. EIESOC says:

        Apoetee Thanks again Peace & Blessings to you.

  31. DuwanFoster says:

    Why is a ghetto a ghetto? What make a high-rise a project and not a condominium? Is its location? or is it the people in it? I remember the projects in Newark they had big and spacious rooms tile floors etc. But the people that lived there did not take care of them! Schools are bad not just because of the teachers but because the kids don’t go there to learn but to socialize!

    1. KhrystleNichole says:

      DuwanFoster That’s exactly right. Black people have always been financially poor in this country. That’s not brand new. What is different are the attitudes about being financially poor. Living in poverty, being financially poor is/should be a temporary condition. However, black people are not just suffering from financial poverty, we are suffering from being emotionally and mentally poor. Now, we have closed our minds and hearts to healing from our sickness. Why do you think so many blacks that have become famous through music and sports still end up getting involved in violence and even going to prison? It is because although they have physically left the poverty and crime ridden neighborhoods that many of them grew up in, they are mentally still there. We have shackles on our minds now. The “man” doesn’t have to put his foot on our neck now. We got a choke hold on our own necks. The government can change policy and grant us an all access pass with even a get out of jail free card to black people. Guess what, many of us wouldn’t use it. The gate is still there but the bars have been lowered and you might be able to jump over to the other side. But we are like dogs in a yard with an invisible fence. Have you ever noticed that in some cities you have a block that’s crime ridden and dirty, but you go 2 blocks over and you think you must traveled to another city because it’s so nice, quiet and clean? And the funny thing, those who live on that crime infested block, never venture around the corner to that “nice neighborhood”. Stop making excuses people and wake up!

      1. AnitaWills says:

        KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster I agree! It is mental slavery!

      2. KhrystleNicholeDuwanFoster 
        ” Black people have always been financially poor in this country.”
        Isn’t that the issue? Shouldn’t you be more focused on that than the “attitudes” of poor people. Why doesn’t the disparity concern you?

        1. whitebl09 says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster Because a poor attitude, lack of effort, and complacency is the reason why many of these people that are still in the projects are there when they could have achieved greatness. Like Mr. Foster said earlier.. what’s the difference between Condos and Projects. They are building low income sub divisions and getting rid of projects in my home town but after a while the subdivisions begin to look run down because there is no sense of pride, lack of respect for neighbors, and since they aren’t paying much and don’t own them, many don’t care to keep them up. Also, we can’t have anything as blacks in this country because of our crab mentality. We can’t stand to see the next brother doing better than us. So instead of trying to acquire wealth, we go and spend everything trying to impress someone we don’t even really know or care about. We don’t support each other, as far as small business owners are concerned, like our parents and grandparents did. We’re always looking for a hookup. Couple that with the fact that an athlete or rapper would rather invest 50k in some strippers over 50k in a few kids college educations. The lists goes on and on.. but this is why we should be focused on attitude… it has a positive effect on everything else.

        2. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster Yes the disparity does concern me. However, we cannot ignore that attitudes do impact outcomes. As I have said before, we can lobby for all the systemic change we want. It will mean nothing without a change in attitudes.

        3. CarolParks says:

          I agree completely. Any persons attitude, can make the difference between success, and failure. It will always come down to an individuals faith in themselves and what they can accomplish. One of the best examples was the story that I believe was on here; of the young girl living in a car, but studied and graduated from high school with excellent grades, despite her horrid circumstances. No child should have to go thru that. But, it shows what determination can do. It really does have a lot to do with attitude.

        4. whitebl09Yvette CarnellKhrystleNicholeDuwanFoster
          “Because a poor attitude, lack of effort, and complacency is the reason
          why many of these people that are still in the projects are there when
          they could have achieved greatness.”
          On what are you basing your observation? If you looked at the white ghettos prior to the New Deal, they’d look a lot like what you see in the ‘hood. What changed them? It wasn’t work ethic or attitude. They don’t work any harder than people with darker pigmented skin and kinky hair. They don’t work any harder than people who worked for FREE in this country for decades. But after the passage of the New Deal, they (immigrant whites) were propelled into the middle class. The further away from poverty they went, the more their behaviors changed.
          But FDR made a deal with the devil, Southern Democrats, to restrict access to blacks. It wasn’t until two decades after the program’s implementation that blacks gained access and to a large extent, we’re still living that, as it pertains to wealth.
          And Ta-Nehisi Coates does a good job of explaining how public policy helped create the ghettos of Chicago and elsewhere. All of this “attitude” talk is just a tool to create division among us, as in Chris Rock’s “Blacks Hate Niggas” skit. It gets no safe quarter here. I call it for what it is – self hatred and elitism.

        5. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell whitebl09 KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster  So Yvette, I have to ask which came first, the chicken or the egg?  Are you saying that some of  the “attitudes” are what they are only because they are poor and aren’t given a chance to better their conditions? Are you suggesting that if you gave most of these people better opportunities and living conditions that their “attitudes” would change for the better? As I state earlier, many of the things that I see going on with black people are more about personal integrity and accountability and not just about the lack of material things. At one time there were black families that had 5-10 kids but guess what….all those kids left the house clean every day and went to school. All those kids had manners and were respectful to their elders. Now today, you see a woman with 2 kids and little means, but probably considering the time, more than what her ancestors had, yet her children are dirty, running in the street, being rude and disrespectful. And no I did not see this on the news or read this on the net…I’ve actually witnessed this behavior in real life!

        6. KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell DuwanFoster What data indicates that blacks have worse attitudes than whites? I’d be interested to know.

        7. KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell whitebl09 DuwanFoster  Slavery came first, then Jim Crow. And yes, if most poor people, black and white, had better skills and access to capital, you’d see them improve their lives. Scarcity has real consequences, both physically and psychologically. You can only worry about “integrity” when you don’t worry about food or housing….when your basic needs are met.  That’s just Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. And if you go to the trailer park, you’ll see a few dirty babies running around there as well. Poor people. Not black people.

        8. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster I didn’t say blacks have worse attitudes than whites. Some whites have messed up attitudes too, especially some of the poor ones. I have seen that too. But we seem caught up in this idea that why can’t we do the same thing whites do and get the same results? It reminds me of when you’re a kid in class and you get caught talking in class and say well Mary was talking too. But the teacher says, well I HEARD YOU!

        9. KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell DuwanFoster 
          You are implying that there is something inherently or culturally wrong with us. That is simply not true. And if Mary was talking too, then the teacher should punish both you and Mary. That’s my point. Why does your judgmental gaze only land on black people?

        10. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole whitebl09 DuwanFoster  Soooo…..because I’m hungry, because my house isn’t so nice, because my clothes aren’t so nice…I lose my integrity? So I think it’s okay to steal from my other poor brothers and sisters and harm them because I don’t have food or nice clothes or a nice house? It’s all about me, right?

        11. jjfair says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster her college profession. I am sure she did not attend an HBCU

        12. KathySandru says:

          My sister was a crack addict who had a daughter (my niece) in 1991. Technically, she should have become a statistic. But you see, my mother, grandmother and I were determined she was not going to be a lost cause. From day one, we taught her how to read; simply by putting magnetic letters and notes on the refrigerator. She became immersed in learning and eventually performed so well that she graduated school with honors. She is now a senior in college, has been in the National Honors Society, the Deans List, and is obtaining her B.S. She wants to go forward to a Masters in Psychology & wants to work with troubled youth. On top of her studies, she works 3 jobs to put herself through college. She recognizes if you want something bad enough, you have to work hard and sacrifice. We are so blessed and so fortunate she is on her right path. And we lived in the ‘hood. See, you can live in the ‘hood, but you don’t have to have the ‘hood mentality. We are proud to have grown up there because it shaped our character. I just wish others could see that. Footnote: sis has been clean for over 10 years and is doing well.

        13. bwdn2008 says:

          KathySandru We need to hear more of those, success stories. That is what I see when I am activating on behalf of the children. I remember a young man who lived with his grandmother and they were just barely making it. He would collect and sell soda bottles so they could eat each day. He did not dress well, but he was always clean. Well that young man is a Four Star General in the Air Force. We are so much more than our environment and more than the clothes we wear. We don’t have to wear Gucci and Prada to be somebody! The one thing about that young man I just described was he did not complain and was always smiling. It is our attitudes that needs to change not only about ourselves but the community in which we live. My house is the place where I have rules meaning it is my sanctuary, not a party house. I don’t do drugs have loud parties, nor associate with folks who do. I like to read, listen to good music, and have good conversations. I believe in education so that we can improve our minds and then we can help others. We have to model behavior for our young people. I am not a Bible Thumper nor a Saint, but every day I strive to be a better person. Of course hind site is 20/20!

        14. CarolParks says:

          KathySandru, what a wonderful, & Inspirational story. I am so happy about your niece, & your sister whom both had success & beat the odds. God Bless you all.

        15. EbenJacob says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster
           Yvette the wrong doing of the oppressor is a fact and a contributing factor. What I seem to notice is that you have refused to acknowledge that we can overcome all this huddles with hard work, determination and personal responsibility. you are yet to accept the fact that we can do better, instead the fault is someone’s else but ours after all we live for them.

        16. KathySandru says:

          Thank you for the kind comments. See, I believe that we as Black folks have two issues that continue to keep us shackled: One, we have forgotten our history and Two: We suffer from serious mental health issues. Please let me explain both:
          Are we aware of the Brothers and Sisters, despite horrendous racism, who have overcome these obstacles to invent and pioneer things that all of us use today? Are we aware the first successful open heart surgery was performed bÿ a Black man (Dr. Daniel Hale Williams)? How about blood plasma used in blood transfusions (Dr. Charles Drew) or refrigeration units? Traffic light? Laser surgery? Black pilots the Tuskeegee Airmen who despite racism upon returning home from WWII were heroes and keys to the Civil Rights Movement? There are many men and women of the past and the present who have pioneered many things who never get a mention in public schools during Black History Month. Well, I teach these to my children so they know we are so much more than just athletic achievements. If more of our children knew about these things, self esteem would skyrocket & prompt them to do better. Google Black Inventors and you will be shocked at all we have invented. By the way, Summer is here. Ever heard of a “Super Soaker?” Yes, we invented that too! We need to also address our issues of self-worth and while racism plays a big part in this, so has the dysfunction in our personal lives and relationships. The myth of the “strong Black Woman” is just that. We have pushed ourselves to the point we feel we have to be everything to everyone & lost ourselves in the process. Same with the men. So we think “status”, “style” and things brings us self worth. well, Air Jordan’s get old, Lexus’ depreciate in vàlue and designer clothes weár out. Champagne taste on a club soda budget. We need to do better.

        17. KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell whitebl09 DuwanFoster Look up Maslow’s hierarchy of needs then get back when me when you’ve fully digested the implications.

        18. jjfair Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole DuwanFoster Who didn’t attend an HBCU? Please continue…

        19. chamberslee says:

          KathySandru 
          Come on, you continue to rely on stereotypes and misinformation. Can you look at the empirical data and have meaningful discussion about the state of the black community and what actions–based on sound reasoning and factual data–do we need to improve Black COMMUNITIES not individual behavior. Individual responsibility is exactly that–individual. It is necessary and we should all practice it, but it will not fix the structural, systemic problems in the black community that require policy reform and enactment. 
          There are many stories of individual responsibility pulling someone from the grasp of despair and hopelessness. In fact, I am one of those persons with a great story about individual responsibility that led to academic and professional success. Yet, I know that the majority of people from my poor community are left behind, as harmful policies  continue to hold them back. The vast majority of them do not complain about their situation. They do not sell drugs to make ends meet.  The vast majority do not fit Cosby’s stereotypes, and they do take responsibility. 
          The point is that we should not label the the majority based on the actions of the minority.

        20. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee KathySandru So true, we do not blame all whites for the Serial, Mass, and Spree Killers who are mainly white males. No matter how much success we have as soon as one black person does something the point the finger at the entire community. The disconcerting part is we go right along with them, and point the finger at our own people. When I go to the old Neighborhood I see the devastation that drugs and crime have left in our community. There are men and women my age, some of whom had bright futures, who were taken down by drugs. They are like the walking dead and it hurts to see them. I feel compassion not revulsion at seeing people suffering like that. We must help the young people who have the potential to be Doctors, Lawyers, Educators, and even Politicians. The solution to what is going on could be in their hands.

        21. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee KathySandru 
          I agree wholeheartedly. When I hear that schools in poor black communities had to close their doors before the completion of the school year due to a lack of funding, I see a structural problem that requires attention. When I hear that the school board voted to close more schools, while at the same time the local government voted to fund the building of a new prison, I cannot look beyond the policies that allow these sort of things to happen. How can the youth be hopeful about their future when they cannot believe in their educational system? What message does it send when the local government closes schools for a lack of funding but funds the building of a prison? This is what I have been trying to get some of the people on this post to understand. 
          The personal responsibility argument distracts us from the policy issues and that is what they want. If we are busy pointing the finger at ourselves, they can quietly destroy communities with harmful polices. 
          Individualism, although important, cannot trump policy.

  32. EIESOC says:

    METHOD TO THE MADNESSLets see for as far as I can remember,most of America’s inner city communities have always suffered from some sort of “Plague”.In the 60’s & 70’s it was the Heroin epidemic,which caused serious addiction & death from overdoses.This went on until a certain element of America’s society started to be effected by this “Plague”.Which led to solutions & action to address the problem.Then there was the 80’s and the epidemic of Crack Cocaine & the HIV virus.This caused major damage to most of Americas inner-city communities of color.This drug left families in shambles,also the increase of the prison population.Violence & Death began to escalate,communities began to crumble.The HIV virus was spreading like a wild fire amongst those who were crack addicts,gay & bisexual.Crack addicted children were being born at a enormous rate,resulting with children growing up with mental issues. Today they are the parents of the troubled youth & young adults who are shooting each other down.The HIV virus was also being spread by intravenous drug use.Most of all once again the incarceration & death of African American males & females began to increase. Again it wasn’t until a certain element of Americas society began to be effected by this inner city “Plague”,were solutions & actions taken to prevent & stop it.Now there’s the 90’s to present day.Hold on a second,Drugs & Disease seem to have been the weapons used in inner city communities of Americas,which I believe was a form of “Genocide” to reduce the populations of color in the communities at large.Now where was I,oh yeah the 90’s to present day.”Gun Violence” the new and effective weapon,which is promoted by various sources.Guns readily available to youth & young adults for self inflicted Genocide.With no end insight to this “Plague” the death toll & prison population has grown a greater level as a result of this. That certain element of America’s society,that I mentioned before,is not being effected by this Plague.Is there a pattern here or is it just me? “Gone are the days of flooding the inner city neighborhoods with drugs to control the population.Just make guns available to those who have no value for life and are willing kill their own.This Method is working,the Madness is those who are largely effected by it are allowing to……NO VIOLENCE-KNOW PEACE!Posted by http://www.blogger.com/profile/14952679522786022030

    1. KathySandru says:

      I totally agree with your post. The main reason “gun violence” has not been addressed in our inner-cities is due to the “thinning of the herd” mindset. Let them destroy themselves & we will “take it all back” through gentrification. Examples: Harlem and Katrina. Look at the rebuilding and who are benefitting from the rebuilds. It will be a matter of time before places like Southside Chicago will transition. Forget the White Supremacists. We are destroying ourselves.

  33. KhrystleNichole says:

    Umm…are they really just stereotypical assumptions? Really? So you’re telling me that you don’t know any black people to whom these “assumptions” apply to? If this is what you’re telling me, then I have to question how much connection have you had with the black community, perhaps outside of your own community? Cosby never said this applied to all poor black people. And he never said that systemic racism and bad public policy does not exist. As I said before, we can’t keep talking about how the system is not working for us when we take no initiative to control the things we can. If these issues only existed with a handful of black people, I don’t think it would be so much of an issue. It’s all a vicious cycle that we have to break. No government policy is going to make it all better for black people. All I’m saying is we have to do our part. You don’t need public policy to tell you not to throw trash on your streets. You don’t need public policy to tell you that you should really go ahead and get that h.s diploma. The public schools aren’t perfect, but there is always something to learn even in imperfect conditions. Public school is not meant to be the final answer. This is where parents have to step in to make sure their children are learning outside of the classroom. You don’t need public policy to tell you to take your kids to the library. You don’t need public policy to tell you to pull your pants up because nobody wants to see your underwear! Do you really need public policy to tell you that because you have little money and no commitment from a particular man and/or that particular man is not available for whatever reason (incarceration, drug addiction, just not that into you), that maybe you shouldn’t have babies with him? Are these just stereotypes? Is this not happening? If it is, why can’t we talk about it? There is usually a bit of truth to every stereotype.

    1. KhrystleNichole
      “Umm…are they really just stereotypical assumptions? Really? So you’re
      telling me that you don’t know any black people to whom these
      “assumptions” apply to?

      I’m telling you to go to the trailer park or any rural white neighborhood and tell me what you see. I’ve worked in gov’t and had many conversations / interactions with low income people. Low income people have more in common with each other than black people. Income is the driver for these behaviors you mention, not pigment.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole  I mentioned before that certain “attitudes” cross racial lines. It is about economics. And baggy pants are different that pants hanging down your a**. So you think it’s okay for a grown man to walk around with his underwear showing?? You’d hire that guy to rep your company and greet your customers just as he is right? Yeah, okay maybe you would. That’s your choice. As far as the kid with the blue dye and goth outfits…no I don’t have to tell him to go wash the dye out of his hair and take off the goth clothes because his white parents and teachers and influences will tell him. And because his people are job creators, they can decide to give him a job anyway. When we, as black people are major job creators, maybe then we can decide that’s it’s okay to hire the black kid with his pants hanging off his butt because he’s coming to “us” for a job. Whites take care of their own. As long as that black man has to go ask the white guy for a job, he is not going to get it like that. First you gotta get the power, then you can call the shots.

        1. KhrystleNicholeYvette Carnell
          ” certain “attitudes” cross racial lines.”
          No, ALL attitudes cross racial lines. And again, what does underwear have to do with any of this? Do you think it’s OK for a kid, white or black, to tattoo him or herself from head to toe? Young people of all races do it. They make “fashion” choices that we don’t necessarily like. I don’t see how that enters into this conversation as  a values choice.
          And the white kid’s teachers aren’t influencing them, not necessarily. Some of them are shooting up schools and theatres. Where’s your outrage about that? But instead, all you can muster is outrage at saggy pants?

        2. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole You’re missing the point. It isn’t about saggy pants. Underwear have much to do with it. What did I just say about underwear? We know that one way out of poverty is to be able to obtain lucrative employment. All I’m saying is how are you going to obtain that if you are not employable. As I said those with the pesos have the say-so’s. When we become a top creator of jobs, then maybe we can show up to work with saggy pants. That’s what saggy pants has to do with this!

        3. KathySandru says:

          Saggy pants are not a fashion statement. It’s nothing more than prison dress. No belts allowed in prison. Do you really want to project a prison mentality upon yourself? As a small business owner, you come to me looking for employment, and you won’t even get through the door. Like it or not, you are what you wear and I can’t have my brand represented as sloppy and incompetent. And no, I am not acting “Bourgie”; I am being real. It’s difficult enough for Brothers to enter the corporate world and be taken seriously (ask Pres. Obama)

        4. KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell You’re making the absurd case here that black boys are unemployed because they show up to job interviews for “lucrative employment” wearing saggy pants. In reality, their lack of employment has much more to do with crumbling schools and the greatest economic downturn since the Great Depression.

        5. KhrystleNichole says:

          I never said that black boys are unemployed because they show up to job interviews in saggy pants. Most aren’t even showing up! The number of black women in college far exceeds black men in college and these black women come from the same crumbling schools. Yet still, there are some black boys who manage to graduate from these schools. The black unemployment rate is higher among blacks but even higher among lesser educated blacks. Everyone is not going to attend college, but not completing a high school education is not going to help better one’s condition. Yes, while whites can drop out and still obtain a 6 figure income at a well-know company, blacks can’t do that. Is that due to racism. Sure it is. At first we were fighting for the right to sit where we pleased on a public bus, drink out of water fountains, use public restrooms, and to live in any neighborhood we could afford to live in. Now we’re fighting for the right to be able to mimic the ill social behavior of white people and get the same free pass. I think our focus has become skewed.

  34. KhrystleNichole says:

    Let’s talk about public policy for a moment. We all know or should know that the US of A does not have friends but interests. With that said, if you are not of interest to the powers that be, you will be ignored. Their interests lie with those who are beneficial to their own interests, primarily economical interests. It’s all about the money. So if the only way you can make their pockets fatter is by keeping the prison system flourishing, facilitating the drug trade, and making the big athletic shoe companies rich and keeping the junk food establishments paid, then that is what they will use you for. They will make sure you have plenty of access to these things. Now of course because of racism, they hope you will eventually destroy yourself and your community with these things. The end result would be to get rid of you and make money off of you in the process. Blacks don’t have access to supermarkets in low income neighborhoods, therefore the residents don’t have access to fresh fruits and vegetables. They don’t have transportation to travel to a supermarket in another neighborhood. The schools in low income neighborhoods have worn and outdated textbooks and the playground equipment is broken. We say public policy needs to mandate that every neighborhood have access to supermarkets that provide fresh fruits and vegetables and all schools have updated textbooks. This is ideal. It may even be the right thing to do. But I know I’m not going to be liked for saying this. There is something different about how people value things when they have to pay for them. This is not just applicable to black people, but people of other races too, including whites. And I say this because I have seen these changes happen for some of the low income neighborhoods and the result has not always been good. There is a saying that goes–“those with the pesos have the say-so’s”. Therefore I am saying that the government is “giving” bare minimal because they have no interest in “giving” anything to black people. Based on history do they owe us? They sure as heck do! But don’t hold your breath. Those reparations aren’t coming. The government collects very little tax dollars in terms of property and income taxes in the poorest neighborhoods. Therefore the people in these neighborhoods are of no interest to the government. It sounds harsh and seems unfair. This is the reason why we have to take the income and resources we do have and utilize them to our greatest benefit. We have to invest in our own communities. We have to invest in our own children. No one is coming to save black people.

    1. lyquidskye says:

      KhrystleNichole  AWESOME post!! Instead of just bashing us, you spoke so well about how and why parts of our culture are what they are.  Just a great way of creating change.. not just bashing folks but talking about the variables that create a system of depression, degradation and racism so that we can figure out a way to change.  And, you spoke about solutions.  Amen sista!

      1. KathySandru says:

        But sometimes you have to get a swift kick in the ass in order to get moving. Dr. Cosby offends some because he is delivering that swift kick. Truth hurts, and you either ignore it or overcome it. And sadly, there are those within our community who ignore it. According to a Neilsen study, African Americans are poised to reach $1.2 Trillion in consumer spending before the end of this decade. Think about this now. $1.2 trillion is a big part of the U.S.’ ENTIRE BUDGET. Yet, we don’t own the Black haircare market, nor do we patronize Black-owned businesses. With the hustles the brothers & sisters make selling drugs in our communities, they can take their art of selling into the corporate world & build up our own businesses and corporations. Yet, we complain how many Indians, Asians, etc., come here & own businesses and racially profile us when walking into their places of business. Worse of all, you have brothers and sisters who have made it who don’t mentor others. You have the Black church who has shirked their responsibilities in our community and have moved to the suburbs for more “lucrative” congregations. Whàt’s it gonna take, people? When are we going to step up and stop waiting for the “new” Martin or Malcolm to come and fight for us? We must honor their memory and step up ourselves. Start with your family, your kids, anyone.

        1. Apoetee says:

          You are awesome- there are more of us taking responsibility than the media shows. I also shocked at California having such a mixture of multicultural relations, but not a resect of individual diversity especailly when it ones ton” Blacks”.
          We need to protect our kids before exposing them to the negative view the outside world has of them.
          Years ago I worked at a LA County medical facility. This facility had a majority of excellent Black doctors and other professionals. A young mother whose son was to graduate said her son made really good grades in school and she was goingbto bring him to the hospital to be introduced to tech guy. I asked her if her sons grades were that good, why did she not bring him there for exposure for being a doctor? She had not even thought of it. She limited her son-
          We have to not give up- continue to encourage, support our businesses and promotepositive us.

        2. KathySandru Cosby gave his first “swift kick in the ass” a few years back. What did it achieve? Nothing, and it won’t.

        3. chamberslee says:

          KathySandru 
          It is not the truth hurting. It is the simplicity, stereotypes and broad stroke used to paint all or the vast majority of lower middle class and poor black people as the problem for all of the ills in the black community.  The vast majority of lower middle class and poor people do not fit Cosby’s stereotypes. So it is a kick in the face–an insult. He should acknowledge that a small percentage of black people, with misdirection from the media, create a negative image for black people.

    2. CarolParks says:

      KhrystleNichole, just a brilliant post! And reparations should be paid to every AA in this country. Not that it would make up for the horrendous horror of the past, & in some places the present, but it would be Acknowledging what did happen. But, unfortunately you are right as I don’t see the leaders of this country complying with this.
      But, taking the power back, so you are Not ignored, and your voices are heard can be a reality. In each community, whether all AA or mixed with others, there should be a community leader, that is honest and has the communities interests at heart. A Pastor? Or someone that people can trust. Have meetings once a week, or every two weeks to discuss the concerns of that community. Then eventually, the leaders of communities across the U.S., communicate with one another and your concerns will not be ignored as you have power in numbers. There is much you can do in each community. If someone is thinking of bringing in a new business, or franchise, everyone vows to support it. My community supports our local business. Two are AA owned, 1 is Arabic, & we have several others that are owned by people who live here. It’s all one step at a time, but can be very successful.
      Problems can be solved more, with your neighbors help. Daycare, fixing playgrounds, can be done with people who have the skills in your neighborhood. Maybe some stores can donate products that are needed. Getting the parents together to Demand better schools, books that are not outdated. Power comes in numbers. Our own President did so much as a community leader. The crackpot people are always the ones to get so much attention on T.V. But, believe me the majority of people I really believe; in this country want Everyone to Succeed. I see that the future will really be between the Rich and the Poor, with no middle class anymore. It won’t be about anything except money. I believe the majority do see the horrendous, crooked, Legal System, the injustice that still exists everywhere for non- whites. The only people saying different are bigots. If we all want real equality, and real changes to the Justice System, Prison System, Schools, History told in schools, good paying jobs, & benefits, etc. then one by one we need to have strong communities, with strong Leaders. Our country is a mess. Mostly because of Congress. But, the corruption is way out of hand. And we Need a Gov. To reflect our population, which has many nationalities, not this heavily. Old, White, Politicians who for the most part in with Wall Street, & The Banks. There are a few good ones like Senator Elizabeth Warren who is actually fighting against Wall Street, & the Banks. But, that is rare. Everything starts in your community, and that can be the beginning of real power.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        CarolParks this is what I’m talking about. Ideas for taking action and not just complaining about what is being said. I believe if you don’t like what someone is saying about you, you can show them better than you can tell them that they are a liar!

        1. KhrystleNichole CarolParks Trying to act to please others is the politics of respectability. Blacks have been chasing that carrot on a stick for years…  Read more about it http://www.blackagendareport.com/content/peculiar-black-%E2%80%9Cpolitics-redemption%E2%80%9Dto understand why what you’re advocating is dangerous

        2. CarolParks says:

          Absolutely! You are a very intelligent lady, KhrystieNichole! I hope people really listen to you. I think you would make an excellent community leader! Enjoy your evening! 🙂

        3. CarolParks says:

          Not acting, just real solutions for problems affecting your community. Taking charge and having dialogue in your community, can bring about wonderful, positive changes. It has already happened in many communities across the U.S. Power is in numbers, & people working together for Positive Change. Enjoy your evening. 🙂

    3. KhrystleNichole What does any of this have to do with reparations? Did I imply that anyone was coming to “rescue” black people? But our duty is to demand a system which treats us fairly, as equal system. We shouldn’t grin and bear gov’t duplicity. We’ve done that for far too long.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        We should demand a system that treats us fairly. However, while we are demanding that system, we have to stop making it easy for them to victimize us. Even mice get smart enough to eventally learn to avoid the mousetraps!

  35. EIESOC says:

    Ladies y’all are droppin some “Jewels” in here.I like this forum.Question though, where the brothers at?

    1. whitebl09 says:

      EIESOC Hey I was here earlier..lol  I agree. I like the discussion as well. I think all of us agree that we want to see our brothers and sisters prosper and I think we can agree that past situations are why we are in the position we are as a people. But my argument has been and still is that you can’t let your environment determine what you become. I came from working class parents and became an engineer because my parents put school and education 1st, 2nd, and 3rd and that was instilled in me. They didn’t want me to have to physically work as hard as them to have as little as them. I don’t always see that same message being instilled in younger kids these days.

      1. AnitaWills says:

        whitebl09 EIESOC You are right it is up to the parents if they are around. Many children are being raised by their grandparents and do not have their actual parents around. My point is that we are pointing fingers at the children who are only mirroring what they learn at home. I am impressed when I see children who are in-spite of going through bad situations continue to excel. I see the children as diamonds in the rough. That brings to mind my grandson who is 15 and excelling in school. He is in honor classes for History and English, and working his first job this summer. He has overcome a lot but is still in the running and I am proud of him.
        Thank you for that positive post!

  36. Apoetee says:

    Please feel free to share any of my poems posted. Also feel free to see my paintings on YouTube under the title Traveling Art Ministry. I am my parents last of 16 children. My mom died three weeks before I graduated high school, my dad died 18 years later. Neither of them had a middle school education, but I have my masters degree in nursing education. I am from E St Louis, Illinois. My parents could not even help me with my home work, but they were mature, from Mississippi and had received their fare share of racial injustice and prejudice.
    Since my vocationis nursing education, it would be expected that I would be promoted in that field ; however, God is sovereign and has mercy on who He will and gives what gift to who ever He will.
    I have only to think and an inspired poem is written: I have only to sit in front of a canvas and an inspired painting happens. God is good, so I share what he gives me with pleasure. Thank you for even requesting to share this gift. Bless you,
    Arene

    1. EIESOC says:

      Apoetee Thank you!

    2. CarolParks says:

      Appetite, Congratulation’s on your wonderful talent! Your optimism is contagious! Thanks for posting your beautiful work. !

      1. CarolParks says:

        Sorry! This stupid iPad self corrects itself. Ugh! It should have said, Apoetee. <<

    3. CarolParks says:

      Apoetee, I apologize, my iPad self corrected. I’m referring to the spelling of your name.

  37. Apoetee says:

    “Bowl of Fruit”
    An array of fruits at the stands ready to go
    Banana, Orange, Apple, Plum, Tomato
    Which one of these will you choose for yourself
    Take that one and leave the rest for someone else
    The Banana you say is the right color for you
    Then cherish it when you eat it: to it do be true
    The Orange you say has the perfect shape
    Just make sure that it is all that you take
    A red Apple is your choice of the day
    Then take it and do not let it get away
    The Plum is dark, juicy and sweet
    Cherish the first time you did meet
    The Tomato is soft and juicy but not sweet at all
    With choices of green, red, large, medium and small
    All of these fruits have its own unique quality
    Pick only one for you and leave the others be
    This way when the next person comes along
    They will have what they want and take it home
    If you are not happy with the fruit that you got
    It may be pretty in a fruit bowl, but inside it rots
    If a lady is not your taste of fruit do not take her home
    It’s best to stay at the market than not loved and alone
    A beautiful array of fruits at the stand all ready to go
    A differentiated quality of beauty now that you know
    Recognize-God made all of us so
    Copyright c by Arene Traveling Art Ministry on YouTube

  38. Apoetee says:

    “Who the Master Now”
    We have a passion for uplifting and loving a people and we hope you all can feel it
    In spite of the love of money taking control of some of our minds, bodies and spirits
    Please no more songs putting young ladies down from guys looking like gangster thugs
    Slapping them, clapping them, crapping them, trapping them instead of giving them hugs
    Ladies,no more making babies to control and trap our men ignoring conventional wisdom
    Whoring them, snowing them, slowing them, flooring them instead of preventing prison
    Revisiting at least thirty to forty years- like back in the sixties
    Envisioning those injustices and prejudices: we stayed on our knees
    We used our mental capacities to keep us one step ahead
    Now we ingest drugs like crazy: fill each other with lead
    No one has to destroy us today because we do a good job ourselves
    We do not recognize a true leader: it seems every man is for himself
    Back then we used to watch what we do, what we say and what we sing
    Oh yea, our actions spoke volumes as uplifting each other was our thing
    We have a passion for uplifting and loving a people and we hope you all can feel it
    In spite of the love of money taking control of some of our minds, bodies and spirits
    Please no more songs putting our ladies down from guys looking like gangster thugs
    Slapping them, clapping them, crapping them, trapping them instead of giving them hugs
    Ladies,no more making babies to control and trap our men ignoring conventional wisdom
    Whoring them, snowing them, slowing them, flooring them instead of preventing prison
    We have to come together people and take care of each other
    No matter what’s up, we are our children, fathers and mothers
    Fill our minds with wisdom, our hearts with respect and our spirits with Godly love
    This is how we can accomplish total health and express what we are made of
    Made in the image of God as he breathed life in us and formed us from the ground
    Recognize our potential and rise above adversity lose self-hate: let self-love be found
    Honor our multicultural diversity in our people and guard the words from our lips
    Walk in faith and develop our characters express virtue and not trap with our hips
    We have a passion for uplifting and loving a people and we hope you all can feel it
    In spite of the love of money taking control of some of our minds, bodies and spirits
    Please no more songs putting our ladies down from guys looking like gangster thugs
    Slapping them, clapping them, crapping them, trapping them instead of giving them hugs
    Ladies,no more making babies to control and trap our men ignoring conventional wisdom
    Whoring them, snowing them, slowing them, flooring them instead of preventing prison
    Yea, who the master now!
    Copyright c by Arene Traveling Art Ministry on YouTube
    of http://www.AreneStheme.com

  39. whitebl09 says:

    “I’ll be damned if I am going to sit and watch our kids continue to grow up believing that it’s cool to be ignorant, violent, high, drunk, broke, uneducated and lazy” -Dr. Boyce Watkins
    Sounds like even Dr. Watkins subscribes to the Cosby train of thought on this issue.

    1. jjfair says:

      whitebl09 I agree with you. For the past 30+ years this has been my fight too. Our children have a need for respect. I taught the worse, as the district said, students and they prove to be the best in the school. 
      I gave respect and demanded mine and allowed them to have a voice in class. White teachers, should say some, fear being challenged especially by Blacks, it goes against their mindset of being superior. Our children are not stupid nor are they ALL special ED.
      Cosby, as with all of us parents, are not perfect, but he is not the end all authority. He should go focus on the child he had out of wedlock.

      1. Apoetee says:

        I thought it was proven only that he had an affair and the woman and her daughter was trying to exhort money from him by threatening to go public with intent to ruin his image.
        The word of God says in reference to a whorish woman: Proverbs 6:27 can a man take fire in his bosom and his clothes and not be burned.
        This is what initially starts out as hot heated passion and turns into what it actually is selfish, deceits and evil! Men be warned and come on women start acting like ladies!
        I think it’s important that we are able to take constructive criticism and not do a tilt for tat don’t correct us on that!

    2. whitebl09 There is a certain insidiousness in mainstream hip hop which pushes backward values, and I think Dr. Watkins is pushing back against that in our community. But I think anyone who listens to rock music knows that rappers haven’t cornered the market on  ‘drunk and high’ music.
      Lastly, I’d be the first to admit that I’m not a carbon copy of Dr. Watkins. I  think he’d be the first to admit that I’m more liberal than he is. We can co-exist without sharing identical politics.

      1. whitebl09 says:

        Yvette Carnell whitebl09 I figured I’d take a shot since your articles are linked to his daily email distribution with a post that has a banner with this quote that to me screams “personal responsibility.” I do understand that though. It’s also good to get more context because it provides perspective, though i feel rappers get a bad rap when again, there should be more parental involvement. But I do appreciate you for pointing out Rock because people act as if Rap is the evil of the world.. and continuously gloss over the  Scarface and Godfather type movies and video games that let you steal cars, kill cops and pick up prostitutes.

  40. YolandaP1 says:

    I want be tired of hearing about it until we change it….Why continue to talk about what the white man did…Mlkj and Rosa Parks didn’t keep talking they took action….I love Mr. Cosby for saying it if more black men/women tht has national connection should be saying and helping the hange….that’s the problem we aren’t saying it anymore…we’ve forgotten where we’ve come from and what it took to get us here…..we do it ourselves

  41. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

    Yvette Carnell I have worked in the public school system for a number of years.  I have one question for you: When do you suggest we began to take personal responsibility for not feeding Johnny when the government gives you money to do so, not having school supplies when agencies freely give them out, but you prefer to get your hair and nails done…not attending parent/teacher conferences. higher education opportunities…

    1. chamberslee says:

      Andrea Carter Coffer Yvette Carnell 
      When you espouse stereotypes or use a broad stroke to paint all or a majority of poor parents as welfare recipients who use their checks to get their hair done and do  not care about their child’s education, you are, at that moment, no different than Rush Limbaugh.  If you truly care about the issue, give it the complexity it deserves. 
      The majority of poor people are honest, hardworking people who want better for themselves and their children. I know because, like your father, my parents had less than a 6th grade education and they taught me the value of hard work and the importance of never giving up.  
      Stating the facts is not placing blame. On the contrary, it gives us a clear path forward so we can improve our black communities. 
      The issue is more complicated than anecdotes and stereotypes–neither is a fair representation of the vast majority of poor black people.  That is were Cosby is wrong.

      1. lionessktty says:

        chamberslee Andrea Carter Coffer Yvette Carnell yet you and the author continue the stereotype of “blame the man”.  The fact is, there are people who have come from less and are doing more.  And I know plenty of folks on the system, still having kids, using their kids’ ss# to get utilities and such- yet go out on black friday and blow a wad of cash on big screen tv’s, playstations, expensive labels, and crap all in the name of “I’m not gonna deprive my child”.  Well here’s the thing, your kid doesn’t need all of that material crap.  All they need is your love, attention, and encouragement to do better and achieve more that you.  I’ve heard and seen enough folks who are taking advantage of the system and not wanting more.  Nowadays it’s like a badge of honor for some to be living off the system yet have a bunch of material crap at home.  You keep talking about “facts” yet you continue to omit these points that have been stated.  
        You continue to foster the stereotype.

  42. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

    @Yvette Carnell Please let us know when the time comes for us to take personal responsibility.  My Dad was a sharecropper with a sixth grade education and has far less opportunities that it is now.  He managed to purchase homes, life insurance, retirement and take care of his family.

    1. Andrea Carter Coffer Please show me the evidence that blacks are more irresponsible than whites. In terms of behaviors, poor people have more in common than black people as it relates to behaviors. And much of the poverty we see in our communities results from public policy.
      Your dad is hard working, as is mine. So why are you here dismissing blacks as lacking personal responsibility?????

      1. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

        Yvette Carnell Andrea Carter Coffer First of all, I’m only referring to your statement because I am on vacation.  Otherwise I would not dignify this rhetoric with a response.  I did not say black are more irresponsible than whites.  There is evidence to support my claim that we must take personal responsibility and put our priorities in order.  I also agree that there are systems in place that work against progress in certain communities…absolutely..While we are fighting for equality we need to make sure we are doing things that we have control of such as making sure our kids eat, go to school, do well in school…we need to hold the system accountable.  I have seen this firsthand and I am a living witness.  I will not allow people to play the blame game with me.  Thats not progress.

  43. JamesHarvin says:

    Yevette, I think you’re missing the point.  You are certainly correct in asserting that we are not he only cause of our problems in this country.  It’s natural that you’d be disappointed in Dr. Cosby because his focus is different from yours.  But, surely you cannot fault someone who focuses on the things over which we have immediate control.  Poor families shouldn’t buy $150 sneakers.  You can’t argue with that, can you?  
    I have yet to hear Cosby deny the institutional albatrosses that burden black people.  Let’s face it.  How many of us have decided not to vote just because we have determined that neither party serves our interest. That may in deed be true.  Yet, the reality is that voting has effects beyond who wins and loses.  Participation is important.
    The thing we have more immediate control of should not be ignored.  That’s all he’s saying.  There’s nothing demeaning about that.  If somebody spills milk, regardless of who did it, we can complain that so and so spilled the milk, or we can get a towel and clean the mess.  Which method really solves the problem?

    1. chamberslee says:

      JamesHarvin 
      I grew up extremely poor and my parents never bought me a pair of sneakers for $150, and I would have never expected them to do so. In fact, there were so few people in my community who did something like that. My point is that Cosby is using a broad stroke to paint all poor people as deviants. It is far from the truth. I know more poor people who are hardworking, law abiding, God-fearing people than I know deadbeats, addicts, and moochers. This is also supported by empirical data.  
      Policy has a great deal to do with problems in black communities–ignorance of the role policy plays in communities is a close second.

      1. JamesHarvin says:

        chamberslee JamesHarvin You are wrong when you say that Dr. Cosby uses “a broad stroke to paint all poor people as deviants.”  Not one word of his comments suggests that “all poor people” do anything.  The idea that he “heaps” blame on “all” poor people is just not true.  He comments on what SOME  people do.  Even you acknowledge that SOME people make decisions contrary to their best interest.  Those are the people to whom he refers.

    2. JamesHarvin How many impoverished people are buying $150 shoes? Are you drawing this assumption from the way in which the news hypes Jordan release day? And you do realize that many of those “thuggish” looking teens are middle class?
      Also, are you making the case that poor people are poor because of tennis shoes? Because that’s the same argument that folks on the right make day in and day out. It’s a conservative argument.

      1. JamesHarvin says:

        Yvette Carnell JamesHarvin I’m not placing blame on poor people.  The blame game is a lose/lose proposition.  SOME poor people make choices that ae against their best interest.  Cosby is not talking to those to whom his comment do not apply.

  44. CSteveK says:

    Yevette,  I too agree with the point Dr. Cosby made regarding not being a victim.  This is America 2010 not 1952, everyone in America with drive, motivation, and perseverance to follow a dream can make in America. The Government cannot be the only tool in your tool bag to achieve in this great country.  We black folks survived when the Government worked against our interests and did not provide any nurturing support.  My simplistic history lesson here  is just to point out preaching self-reliance in no new message within the black community.  Don’t shot the messenger of a timely and needed message ….

  45. Kombozi says:

    Yvette you don’t have a clue… Granted, there is certainly a conspiracy to oppress our people, but it doesn’t matter… It still comes down to personal responsibility for 2 reasons:
    1) We can never expect our enemy to do anything to help us.
    2) Once we unite, we can defeat the white man with ease.

    1. chamberslee says:

      Kombozi 
      Personal responsibility without policy enactment and reform will not do a thing to improve black communities–not a thing. Other communities realize this, but it appears to be too difficult a concept for a vast majority of the black community.

      1. Kombozi says:

        Chamberslee,
        You misunderstand, when I say personal responsibility I don’t just mean on an individual level… That’s why I said “When we unite…” You sound like you still expect the white establishment to help us. They will never do that, because they are our adversaries and they fear our latent power…
        Ultimately it still comes back to Black People seizing our own destinies and being the masters of our own fate… Your philosophy of pleading to the enemy for change is disempowering and illogical.

        1. chamberslee says:

          Kombozi 
          I am not speaking philosophically nor am I pleading to the enemy. One of the greatest lies ever perpetrated is that personal responsibility will solve the black community’s problems.  In fact, that is typically a conservative argument used by Glenn Beck and other conservatives of his ilk when they want to end funding for a problem that gives poor blacks a hand-up. 
          What is illogically is that far too many black people think it is begging or asking for a handout demand our political leaders, especially Obama, address policy issues that are unique to the black community.

        2. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

          Kombozi I agree…Frankly, I’m tired of us blaming people for our societal woes.  Now we know the problem, lets unite for a solution.  Our races do it all the time.  We did in the past and it was success

      2. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

        chamberslee Kombozi I’m doing my part. I will not be a part of the problem.  Opportunities are out there..I know because I have taken advantage of them…

  46. onenine08 says:

    I believe he was referring to corporate greed and personal responsibility. Poor people fall victim to corporate greed in that large corporations shove low quality living down the throats of poor people because its cost effective i.e. cheap processed foods. On the other hand, people must take responsibility to do whatever they can to improve their condition. One example of where the two converge is poor people trying to find identity through their apparel. Corporations have convinced folks that there is real value in paying hundreds (to thousands) of dollars for a pair of sneakers that cost pennies to manufacture. People — there is no value in that. As Michelle Singletary says “If it is on your ass it is not an asset.” I know I’m rambling so let me sum it up like this … we are in desperate need for a paradigm shift in Black America. As Bill Cosby said (in my own words) in general our priorities are all f’d up.

    1. onenine08 says:

      I should have made it clear that I meant corporate greed in relation to what Toni Morrison had to say. STATUS (which includes money and greed) is ONE of the main issues killing our community.

  47. CarolParks says:

    It is our Government, and Legal system, that are stopping true equality in this country. There is no doubt about that, it is corrupt. And things are slated against people of colour, and the poor also. But, I do believe that Mr. Cosby is really trying to just inspire people, and not bring them down.
    Many of the comments on here and other blogs, always reference a self hatred. When you look at Whites, we too have problems with our youth, such as tattoo’s, drugs, gangs, teen pregnancy, and so forth. We have people making fun of white people as Rednecks, living in Trailer Parks, the Ozarks, White Trash, etc. there are many stereo types of anyone in this world. I believe that Mr. Cosby and others are saying look into yourself, and believe that whatever it takes that you can succeed and to believe in yourself. Any Leader or Mentor will always tell you to stay away from doing things that will hurt you in life. I think that is all it is with Mr. Cosby. He is just trying to inspire people to do better. He supports and has also created wonderful programs, and charities to help AA kids to succeed. He is not the enemy here. The real enemy is poverty, our corrupt legal system, and our own Gov., that is ignoring the real issues in this country.
    Good people, of any culture or background, want equality, success, and happiness for all. The ones who don’t, are simply evil. From some of the personal stories on here, you can see the wonderful triumph, and pride in how they overcame the odds. Inspiration is a wonderful thing to bring about success. But, in reality we also need Major changes to our Legal System, and Gov.
    Education, and good schools should be for Every child in this country. And safety in those schools, and neighborhoods everywhere should be a priority. What has been happening in Chicago with all these children being killed everyday, should be on the news every night, with Everyone in this country Demanding something be done, to stop this. This is horrendous and where are the Community Leaders, Mayor, Governor, & others? Every parent in America needs to stand up & say, no more! Just like with Trayvon Martin, & all the Trayvon Martins out there, no more killing our children. I don’t care what your colour, religion, or anything else is, we are all humans of the human race, and these children need for everyone to stand up & demand justice, protection, for our children, and arrest & prosecute anyone who would hurt a child. G Zimmerman, should have been arrested with No Bail, for Murder One, since he did stalk him, that was Pre meditated. But, that’s another subject. Just like the Truth of the History of this Country Not being told in our schools. And some Morons in Texas in charge of what goes into our history books. Another disgrace.
    My main point here, as I tend to get distracted, is that it should not be everyone divided, as in us against them, but instead it should be everyone together fighting this horrendous injustice together, fighting together for all children, and the people who disagree with that should be ignored. There is always more power in numbers, and there are good people as well as bad in every group in this world. Pretty soon, it won’t be a country divided by culture, or religion, but rather the poor, and the rich only with no more middle class. Unless everyone does everything to stop it, including voting for Your Interests, and I’m hoping for a third party that will be for the people, with real term limits as in no more then 4 years in office for anyone. They are supposed to be working for You.

  48. chamberslee says:

    The prominent sociologist William Julius Wilson wrote a book titled “When Work Disappears: The New Urban Poor” that I recommend for anyone who wants a factual account of how ghettos are created. That is right: Ghettos were created by government policies and actions, not poor people or black and brown people–not even crime. Suburbanization is a good example. 
    Post-World War II, cities were becoming crowded with all of the GIs coming home and creating families, so the government came up with an ideal: create an incentive so people will be willing to move out of the city. The solution was subsidies and low interest home loans. Blacks were excluded from moving into the new suburban communities, however. As more and more whites saw the benefit of moving to the suburbs, they left the city in record numbers–taking with them their business, wealth and political influence. The negative consequences intensified with white flight, black exodus, red lines that concentrated blacks in the poorest part of the city. Even today policies are creating more difficulties in black communities: mass incarceration (due the ostensible war on drugs, child support enforcement, and for profit private prison opportunities) resulting in the breakdown of the family unit and significantly affects earning potential for the person with a criminal record, jobs relocating to the suburbs out of the reach of black and brown persons in the inner city, failing and closed schools, low wages requiring the parent(s) to work multiple jobs to make ends meet and so forth. Over time, the inner cities are populated primarily by poor black and brown persons and have become high transient areas where residents move in and out of communities within a a few years, which creates a lack of connection or commitment to the community.    
    It does not take much for a community to transition from middle class to ghetto and policy has a great deal to do with it. Taking person responsibility is important but will not affect the change needed. We have to hold our political leaders accountable and let them know our vote is not free–that includes Obama.
    I respect Dr. Cosby but he is wrong to place all the blame on poor black and brown people without acknowledging the role policy plays in the  lives of ghettos. Further, he is simplistic and stereotypical in his attacks and that does not bring solutions to the table but alienates blacks, instead.

    1. KhrystleNichole says:

      I don’t see that Mr. Cosby has placed ALL the blame on poor black people. A lot of things (excuses) said to be the reason for blacks living in poverty seem to be things that black people DO have control over. If Mr. Cosby is blaming poor black people then some of you have deemed them as weak, helpless, defenseless victims. You speak as if we just can’t help but go to prison. We can’t help but to use and sell drugs. We can’t help it that we don’t get an education which locks us into having to accept minimum wage jobs which will not help us get out of poverty. So it would be useless for us to even try to stop engaging in these self defeating behaviors because we don’t have enough “public policy” to affect a change in our conditions anyway. I don’t get this because if this were truly the case, then all black people would still be living in “the ghetto” and working for minimum wage no matter what. I guess the black people who did leave the ghetto and obtained well paying careers and businesses did so by luck and by accident? A lot of the reason for Black exodus from the ghetto is because sadly too many of us have the crabs in a barrel mentality. This same mentality is also a reason why many are still there. But, I guess we shouldn’t blame poor Black people for that

      1. chamberslee says:

        KhrystleNichole 
        If you read empirical studies on the criminal justice system in America, you would know that corrections is a multi-billion dollar industry where lobbyists are ensuring criminal justice policies are passed that will guarantee private prisons remain at or near capacity. Mass incarceration has little to do with crime and more to do with profit. As the prison population was increasing in the late 80s and early 90s, the crime rate had already decreased and continued to do so for about 25 years–that includes drugs. The increase in the prison population was due to criminal justice policies such as truth in sentencing, sentencing guidelines, mandatory minimums, three strikes laws and so forth.  In addition, a new study shows that white people use drugs significantly more than do blacks. Yet, blacks are the ones going to prison at an alarming rates. That is in art to police practice of saturation and making an easy pinch, but that is another conversation. 

        My point is that you should look beyond what you think know and be open to hearing and seeing the facts. Cosby uses broad strokes and stereotypes to misrepresent the facts and muddy the water so it appears to be the majority of a particular group of people causing the problem: poor and middle class blacks.

        In 2004, Cosby stated unapologetically that (and I am paraphrasing) those low middle class and poor blacks are the problem making other blacks look bad. He mocked black parents for crying because their child had been killed by police–he was cold and he was wrong. And as usual, he relied on stereotypes and half truths. That is my problem with Dr. Cosby. 

        Again, read the book from one of the most respected sociologists of the twentieth century and you will see how policy is the issue. Dr. King knew that. Everything Dr. King did was to overturn oppressive policy: the bus boycott, sit-ins. peaceful protests, getting arrested. It all accumulated in the passage of the civil rights act–POLICY enactment. Personal responsibility would have never gotten us civil rights. That is a fact that cannot be logically disputed.  It is still true, today. 
        Personal responsibility without policy enact and reform equals status quo.

        1. KhrystleNichole says:

          Chamberslee, you know what… That’s not the argument. No one is arguing that public policy has not had a negative affect on Black people. At least that’s not my argument. I just can’t minimize our own responsibility for the sake of shifting most of the blame to public policy. I think you believe that blacks who argue for personal responsibility speak from some type of conservative rhetoric that they read about or hear from Glenn Beck. Do you realize that many proponents of personal responsibility speak from experience? Most blacks are no Glenn Becks or Rush Limbaughs. Many of us did not come from a background anymore privileged than the people who you defend and we all live by the same policies. Therefore, there has to have been a reason why some blacks have been able to improve their lives and others haven’t. What would you say the reasons are? If it wasn’t due to personal responsibility and it wasn’t do to better public policy, then please tell me how these blacks, like Mr. Cosby were able to become successful?

        2. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole 
          First, it is rather simplistic to view the success of a few individuals and conclude that everyone else in the black community must be to blame for their circumstances because they apparently did not practices personal responsibilities like those who were able to move out of the ghetto. 
          I am looking at the bigger picture which is shaped by policy  and only policy reform can undo much of the damage that has been caused in black communities over the past few decades.

        3. KhrystleNichole says:

          Your premise seems to be that if policies are created that are more favorable to poor black people, they would prosper. I can’t say that I agree that centuries/decades of psychological trauma can be undone with a stroke of a pen. I think it may seen less challenging to ask congress to enact new laws and new policies as opposed to trying to change the mindset of a group of people.

        4. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole 
          We are not talking about centuries ago. Bill Clinton enacted some of the harshest criminal justice policies of the early 90s that are partly responsible for the continued increase in the prison population. Drug crimes have declined significantly but more and more black males are incarcerated than ever–although whites are the typical drug users. That is a policy decision supported by lobbyists. Criminal justice policy that benefit private corrections corporations is a major factor in mass incarceration that destroys the family unit in black communities. Read “The New Jim Crow.” 
          That is one example of recent policies affecting black communities, not hundreds of years ago, and there are many more–education, for example. Chicago is closing dozens of schools in poor communities. How is personal responsibility alone going to change the fact that many youth are going to be crowded into already crowed schools that are also suffering from a lack of funding? What about policies that continue to give incentives to companies to move jobs to the suburbs, out of the reach of those who live in the inner city? 
          I agree about the need for responsibility, but I do not believe it is the problem nor the answer in the black community: It is structural issues that require policy reform and enactment.

      2. Apoetee says:

        You are so right on here. Something you should continue to live in an area where your house is broken into multiple times.
        No necessarily saying your living in an area where your body will never be discovered is the best choice either lol.
        I am from East Saint Louis, Illinois. We were so poor the or is missing in the word, but being poor, and raised in a poverty stricken town does not equal criminal, multiple baby daddy unwed momma, uneducated, drugged out, pimped out, self hating, stay down here with me mentality.
        How many of us know about the public policy of ensuring welfare to poor unwed, moms? How many of us can name a relative who is taking advantage of the system by either having more children enslaved in the system as opposed to utilizing meager gvernment resources as a temporary stepping stone. Where is the love for a child when a parent will say” I’m struggling and I do not want a child to be born into this just because I want to have sex?” Foreigners come here and use the system as well.
        There is enough in the world to get kids off track so setting on the right track is the best!

  49. MicheleLoving says:

    Do government play a role, yes it does. By making welfare permanent than what it was suppose to be temporary.  Here in  Baltimore,  single family development of Loch Raven, Northwood, Federal Hill, Mount Vernon, Hamilton, Violetville, and others were white populated areas.  Blacks resided in slums of Murphy Homes, Upton( where Billie Holiday was born, and the famous Royal Theater was), Caroline and Pratt, etc.  known as the projects after the wars.  Since then, the city government destroyed some slums only to build townhomes that were suppose to increased property value but only allow the same residents to move in and when I walk by the homes along Martin Luther King Boulevard, I see the trash and the dismay. My parents met in the 70s Balitmore, dad born in Philly, like Mr Cosby.  And mom, in San Antonio TX, part of a military family.   Big Momma is gone, the lady who sat on the stoop or porch and watched us play, grow, and get in trouble.  She knew our parents,  she gave us a good talking too and she snitched.  This type of LOVE kept us in line and out of Jail.   Dr. Cosby is from the Philly projects, he based the cartoon on his friends were in Philly.  He is prominient, he has faced diversity and racism in his life.  Cosby was the first black man alongside a white man, as a lead in a prime time sitcom, “I Spy”.   One thing that I have learned is to respect the elders.  The family unit has broken down through generations and decades.  There is no personal responsibility anymore.  Its everyone’s fault but my own when my child is failing in school.  But as her mother, I don’t check her book bag, don’t make a surprise visit to her class, volunteer at the school, spend time with her and ask how her day was, go to meetings.  But as soon as the  school closes, I have BEEF!!!  Because NOW, I have to take off from work, waste MY time to enroll her into another school.  OR she is suspended for fighting, so I am going up there to curse out the principal.  MY child don’t act out, she is PERFECT but her report card says otherwise. 
    So I agree with Cosby.  He is parent who is still mourning the lost of his son.  Ennis was changing a flat tire, when he was shot in the head.  HE feels what another feels to bury your child.  Now he may come off abrasive.  But as a black man, that done alright in his lifetime as a right to look at the black community and ask, “What tha Hell?”   In Baltimore, last summer the city celebrated the anniversary of the War of 1812 at Fort McHenry, where our National Anthem was created.  Ships from all nations docked at the Inner Harbor.  There were some school kids, and they were complaining about the noise of the F-19 Blue Angels flying above. So I asked them, “What is the problem?”  and they asked what is going?  So I told them.  This is where I wanted to go to Texas and pimp slap Fmr Prez Bush for taking out history and geography out of the curriculum.  “What is the War of 1812?”  I asked, “How do you think America got their independence?”  I kid you not.  The boy said, “The slaves freed America”.  Who told you that?  Are you serious?  There is no pride within the black community. When our children DO NOT KNOW THEIR HISTORY.  I see them on the buses, no respect.  No one should have to tell you that the elderly and disabled sit in the front. There is a sign plain as day. Then you get an attitude.  MTA should do an experiment one day, have these young people get on the bus to pay, then tell them they have to enter from the side or back of the bus and they can’t sit in the front.  Maybe they will appreciate what they have more better.  I am all for other  nationalities coming over for a better life.  Blacks were already here and were brought over here from Africa, we were immigrants.  Europeans coming over on ships into Ellis Island were also immigrants.  Who is PURE WHITE in America?  Everyone including blacks are mixed with something.  There are things that need to be said, are we afraid of the truth?  We were once a community as a village that raised our children.  Now there is no community anymore, how do we get it back?   Not by tearing each other down when we give opinions about us.  And this is exactly what you are doing on this feed.  You don’t want to hear and face the truth, so Yvonne you want tear down people who have an interest of telling us blacks the truth about ourselves.  As a black woman, I told Social Services to go to hell!!  I would rather work two jobs to give my son what he needs than to deal with ya’ll, like your jobs are not indispensable.  Women need to be more leery on the type of man they are dealing with.  There is nothing wrong about having standards.  The 90 day rule is actually a GREAT IDEA!!   AIDS is the number one killer among African Americans.  We have to do better.  Our children DON”T FEAR anything, there is corruption in the police department and the prison system.  ITS better for Philly to close down their schools in order to build a $400 million prison.  That money could be invested back to the children.  And you all are complaining on what COSBY says!!!!!!!
    GROW UP!!!

    1. chamberslee says:

      MicheleLoving 
      But you point to a policy that needs attention in order to give our youth a hopeful future: Closing schools while building a $400 million dollar prison. 
      Cosby admonishing the lower middle class and poor blacks as the problem for the black community’s ills does not do a thing to improve communities. In fact, he alienates the very people he supposedly is trying to help. One does not motivate another by using conservative racial stereotypes, half truths and misinformation and painting all blacks with a board stroke.  And personal responsibility without policy reform and enactment will not change anything. Sure, a few people here and there will be make it out of the ghetto but entire communities will continue to be left behind. 
      Stereotypes is all I hear. How is that helpful? Federal census data show that most crime in poor communities are committed by about 5% of that community’s younger male population: They tend to be habitual offenders. That means that 95% of poor people do not fit any of the stereotypes you and Cosby espouse. It simply is not true. The majority of poor people are hardworking, law abiding, God-fearing people who want better but rarely complain or ask for handouts–although many of them require assistance because of low wages and high cost of living.  
      Do not look to examples that fit your conclusion; look at all policies that negatively affect the black community.

      1. lionessktty says:

        chamberslee MicheleLoving if someone is alienated, it’s because the truth hurts.  Instead of sitting around complaining about what the government doesn’t/won’t do for us (stereotype you are encouraging), take responsibility and do something yourself, for yourself.  Yeah, there are many law-abiding hardworking poor no one is denying that.  And there’s no denying that there are roadblocks in the system.  But I’ve seen and know plenty of poor who have changed their situations by using what was handed to them and going beyond that hand to get what else is out there for them.  
        I honestly feel it’s your thinking that encourages some folks not attempt for more.

      2. KhrystleNichole says:

        chamberslee  Cosby’s admonishment toward the lower middle class and poor blacks does not help improve communities because they won’t listen! As lionessktty and many others have said here, the truth hurts. Many feel that Bill Cosby has no right to tell them anything because they see him as famous, successful and rich. However, there are people who are not famous, have achieved moderate success but by no means rich, who have said the same things and they still aren’t listening. Instead of becoming angry with those who have done better than you, I would think it would be in one’s best interest to listen and find out what they did to become more successful. How is it they are too proud to listen to someone who has done it tell them how to do it, but not too proud to ask for government assistance? And chamberslee, it’s not just violent street crime that’s decimating the poor communities. It’s drug addiction, alcoholism, prostitution, child abuse and elder abuse. Again, we all agree that this does not describe everyone who is poor. And by the way, not complaining, is part of the problem! Why keep waiting for some community leader, e.g. Al Sharpton or Jessie Jackson to be their voice? Why not be their own voice? There is unity in numbers and no one can sit back complacent waiting for someone to speak for them. When you wait for someone else to tell your story, you can’t complain about the conclusion. You say that only a few make it out. Once again, I have to ask how did those “few” make it out when they were subjected to the same schools, same neighborhoods, same laws, same policies? Since, according to you, it had little to do with personal responsibility, I guess it was by luck or by accident huh?

        1. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          His admonishments do not work because he is saying to the working class family who does everything right that they are bring down the black community. He is saying to the person who works two jobs that you are worthless and bring down the black community. He is saying to the black mother whose son was killed by the police for no other reason than being black that it was your fault he was killed. What he said in 2004 is an insult to the parents of Trayvon Martin because they fit his stereotype: lower middle class, child had problems that suggest a lack of parenting (based on what Cosby said). He joked about a fictitious mother crying because her son was killed by police–he mocked all poor people who ever lost a child to police brutality because poor and lower middle class people supposedly deserve it because they are poor and lower middle class and apparently do not love their children the same as high income blacks. 
          They should not listen to Cosby when he does not have the decency to show compassion and understanding that not all poor or lower class black people behave in stereotypical ways. It is a fact, based on government data, that only 5% of people in poor communities commit crimes. That is right: five percent. Those five percent are young, black, male habitual offenders, however: They commit numerous offenses. The media focuses only on criminal behavior in poor black communities and create the perception that ALL residents in that community fit the image and behavior of a few. It is smoke and mirrors. The vast majority of poor people do not fit the stereotypes, and that is why few people listen to Cosby. Rightfully so.

        2. KhrystleNichole says:

          When, when did Cosby ever say that this was ALL lower income black peopl?!? I did not read that nor have I heard him say that. I think there are a lot of people who are a little sensitive to his remarks because they perhaps feel that his statements do apply to THEM in some way. If the shoe fits, wear it! Personally, I’m not insulted by something someone says that doesn’t apply to me. He never said all poor blacks were irresponsible.

        3. JamesHarvin says:

          KhrystleNichole  You are so correct.  Not only didn’t Dr. Cosby not suggest that his statements referred to all black people, he said nothing that could be fairly described as berating.  He talked about some self-destructive things that SOME  black people do.  He also advocates that black people address that things over which they have control.  
          I never understand why some refuse to acknowledge that sometimes black people can make errors in judgment.  Addressing those issues does not suggests that racism doesn’t hit us hard, nor does it blame black people.  The first step to healing anything is to acknowledge its existence.  Sometimes I think that those who fail to admit that we SOMETIMES can do better hold us back as much as does racism.

        4. chamberslee says:

          JamesHarvin KhrystleNichole 
          In 2004, Cosby said, “…the lower economic and lower middle economic people are not holding up their end of this deal” (Dyson, 2005, p.141), as he made some of the most ridiculous accusations about these people as he referred to black people who did not fit neatly into the middle class. He accused the lower and lower middle economic class for the problems in black America. He did not talk about SOME black people and SOME of the things they do. If he had I would not have a problem with that because that is true: Some black people fit his stereotypes but the vast majority do not. From that 2004 speech, Cosby has been consistent in his attack on lower economic and lower middle economic black people. That is a fact.  Although this article is not as detailed as some of his other rhetoric on this issue, it is in his wheelhouse. 
                                         References
          Dyson, M. E. (2005). Is Cosby right?: Or has the black middle class lost its mind? New York, New York: Basic Civitas Books.

        5. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole 
          On May 17, 2004 while speaking at an event in Washington, DC to commemorate the fiftieth anniversary of the Brown v. Board of Education decision, an event sponsored by the NAACP, the NAACP Legal Fund and Howard University, Cosby began his tirade and blamed what he called these lower economic and lower middle economic people for the problems in Black America (Dyson, 2005).
           References 
          Dyson, M.E. (2005). Is Bill Cosby right?: Or has the black middle class lost its mind? New York, New York: Basic Civitas Books.

        6. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee Cosby has also talked about how crimes by black youth are overreported in the media. He has talked about the importance of healing drug addiction. Most important he has spoken a lot about loving and caring for our children which is where it all begins. But how are we going to take care of our future if we can’t seem to get a grip on the present? I think Cosby has said a lot of important things about the state of black people. I think he has said some thing that hit too close to home for some blacks, even the ones who have supposedly made it out of the ghetto. Too many of us continue to engage in self-destructive behavior even after we have left the ghetto. There are many of us, meaning black people, who have Master’s degrees and Ph.D.’s and live in a nice community with manicured lawns, yet we still like to spend our weekends up in the club and spend more time and money on our wardrobe and hair than on investing in our children. Yes, he called us out. And now some folks are mad and their feelings are hurt. I think there are actually more so-called middle class black folks walking around here with hurt feelings than poor black folks. Now the former group wants to pretend like they’re just so upset about him talking about the latter. Maybe you’re mad because it used to be you. Maybe you’re mad because it sounds like your sister, your brother, your best friend. Maybe you feel it’s STILL you. There are other well-off blacks who share the same thoughts about our condition as Cosby. They just aren’t saying anything. Maybe they aren’t saying anything because they need you to buy their sneakers or clothing line or drink that alcohol they are endorsing or buy that car they are advertising. Cosby’s an easy target. People you better wake up!

        7. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          Mad. How did you come to that conclusion? What am I mad about. I am no different than Dr. Dyson in my desire to see that the issue receives the complexity it deserves. I do not agree with simplicity and challenge people to look at facts–empirical data instead anecdotes, stereotypes and over generalizations.  
          If Cosby took an objective view and acknowledged  that SOME in the black community are not doing their part (that the vast majority are doing the best they can under the strain of oppressive policies) and then pointed out that social structures along with individual responsibility need to be addressed, I would support him wholeheartedly because that is a balanced view that attempts to find solutions to a difficult problem–not simply attack an entire economic group of people. 
          You have not addressed my statement that the vast majority of poor black people are not criminals, drug addicts, thugs and so forth. In fact, the typical criminal is white: That is a fact (see Michael Moore’s Crazy White People).

    2. CarolParks says:

      Michele, thank- you, for posting this. Everything you said, rings of truth. And BTW, I think all kids everywhere do not respect their elders at all anymore. And you are so right about history, especially the real history of this country which is not taught anywhere.

  50. KhrystleNichole says:

    When The Cosby Show aired in the 80’s, some Blacks were complaining that the show was unrealistic because black people don’t live like that. Perhaps that was fantasy for some black people since that reality seemed so far removed from their own existence. Now we are complaining because Cosby is saying far too many blacks don’t live like his t.v. family did because they are living at the opposite end of the spectrum. There are complaints that this isn’t true either and his views are based on stereotypes and exaggerated images of a few. It is true that the upper class of the black community comprise, the black elite, represent less than 1% of the black population.  However, over 27% of blacks are currently living in poverty and that poverty rate approaches 40% for black children, who mostly reside in single parent households. That’s pretty grim when blacks only comprise 13% of the population. If we are going to go with the premise that unfair public policy and poverty are the primary predictors for one to live a life of crime, poor decisions and generational poverty, then we can also say that a show like Good Times was fantasy too. The reason I mention this is because this show represented a black family who despite the fact that they were poor, they actually raised their children and taught them to be honest, respectful and that they had a future. I know both of these situations are a reality. The one thing that both of these shows had in common is that neither attributed their success to government intervention. There seems to be an stagnancy within the black community and we, as a people continue to see ourselves as victims. (Recommended reading: Brainwashed by Tom Burrell). Our actions have become very one-sided which may be the reason why we are making so little progress. We are on here discussing this matter among ourselves but the most of the people who really need to participate in these discussions are not here! They probably don’t have access to the internet and if they do, sadly many are probably more interested in Kim and Kanye than this matter at hand.

    1. chamberslee says:

      KhrystleNichole 
      I do not remember blacks complaining that Cosby’s show was unrealistic and that black people did not leave that way. I do remember, however, some white people feeling that the show as  an inaccurate representation of the way black people live.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        Umm…..yes, as incredulous as it sounds, some blacks did express that.

        1. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole 
          I can see that…there are always a few.

      2. Honey Hayes says:

        chamberslee KhrystleNichole The really sad part of that assessment; there are more black families living the lifestyle depicted on the Cosby Show than many people will acknowledge.

        1. KhrystleNichole says:

          Honey Hayes chamberslee So very true. We know that the media only covers very selected images of black people and if you’re from a particular neighborhood, of course you don’t see black people living like that. That’s why it’s important to expose children to life outside of their immediate environment. I would tell my daughter all the time that there’s a whole world beyond your own backyard.

        2. chamberslee says:

          Honey Hayes chamberslee KhrystleNichole 
          Are you basing that assertion on your eye test or scientific facts? The empirical data indicate that the majority of black people do not fit Cosby’s depictions. That is a fact. Now of course we can all point to examples that fit Cosby’s point, but the problem is his simplistic over generalization: grouping all poor and lower class blacks in to one category and accusing them of being the problem for all black America’s ills. That assertions is not only wrong but detrimental to the black community. 
          Cosby is using racist talking points that have been espoused by Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, Ann Coulter, Sarah Palin, the authors of the Bell Curve, FOX and so on. It is a distraction form the real issue: policy. States are closing dozens of schools that will have a negative impact on poor black students. How is individual responsibility going to address this issue? Collective protest demanding policy change that improves education in poor communities is a better option. 
          Philadelphia is closing schools but it can afford to build a $400 million dollar prison. Again, how does individual responsibility help in this situation? It is a distraction from real issue–policy.

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee Honey Hayes KhrystleNichole Good point! When I read peoples posting about Government Programs ire reminds me of how whites use that against blacks. Most Government Assistance goes to whites, not black folks. In fact Welfare was not started for Black folks it was for poor whites. When I was growing up all of the Welfare Offices were in white neighborhoods. It was no problem until blacks started getting on welfare, around the time of the Vietnam War. That was when our men were being sent to die on the Front lines, and coming back in body bags, with PTSD, or on drugs. Some of the younger posters do not know what a draft was, but you should pay attention. If we go to war in the Middle East you will be subjected to the draft.  This time it will include women as well as men. That was a pivotal time for our community even more so than the Civil Rights Movement. Yet few people look at that as something that affected us economically and socially.  Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

        4. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee Honey Hayes KhrystleNichole 
          That is my point: History tells us that policy has the greatest impact on the state of poor people, in general, and black communities specifically. The post-Vietnam war is a good example. Another example is post-World War II when the government began welfare programs (known as subsidies) to encourage people to move out of the city to the suburbs. Black people were excluded, however. While whites were buying homes and land and building their wealth, blacks were being pushed into the poorest parts of the city. As white flight continued, neighborhoods that were once diverse became predominately black. Consequently, the communities were devalued, as businesses moved away and wealth and influence was drained from once prosperous communities. Add the black mass exodus, downsizing, outsourcing and the ostensible war on drugs and you have a more complete and fair picture of how policy shaped ghettos and why policy reform is critical to shaving communities. My point is that we have to add complexity to the discussion because it is not as simple as Cosby and others state: The majority of poor black people are the problem because they are not being responsible.

        5. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee bwdn2008 Honey Hayes KhrystleNichole You are right on with the historical timeline. That is what is missing from this discussion. I believe it is because people do not learn history anymore. The Black History and ethnic studies classes are non existent. Folks get their information from the media, TV, or the movies.  I want to bring up another issue that folks don’t want to talk about, church. The church I was raised in taught us that we were born in sin. Anything negative that happened was because God was angry at us. My white friends went to a church that told them that they were, “Good”  They were the Anglicans, Episcopalians, and Lutherans, who sing God Bless  America, while standing on the bones of Natives their ancestors massacred. In other words African Americans (by and large), are taught that we are bad while white folks are seen as, “Innocent.”

        6. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee Honey Hayes KhrystleNichole 
          It is difficult for far too many black people to have open dialogue about church and religion. I have gone through all of the emotions one can have about what the black church means or should mean or what is does not do or what it should do. As you know, the black church was once vital to the spiritual well-being of the community. It was a part of the community and that meant something. Now, the church is located in the community but has little connection to the community in terms of supporting the community in a spiritual and caring way. It is all about the so-called prosperity gospel while the people paying their tithes suffer the most. We spend too much time trying to buy our way into haven rather than doing what God asked us to do: Give of ourselves to the least among us and live by the golden rule to treat thou neighbor as we want to be treated. If the black church could go back to its purpose when it reached out to those in need, that would improve the quality of lives in black communities throughout America.
          Unfortunately greed has replaced compassion and the black church has an identity problem it cannot recover from.

        7. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee bwdn2008 Honey Hayes KhrystleNichole I have fond memories of growing up in the Church I attended as a child. We learned to read and recite there. We learned to sit still, be respectful of our elders, and have compassion. We ate there and welcomed members who were new to the community. Anytime someone needed money we got together and had a special offering or sold, chicken and fish dinners.  Any of the adults in the church could correct and/or pop a disrespectful child. We knew Jesus was black because black folks played him every Christmas (smile). There was no Easter Bunny it was the resurrection of Christ that we celebrated. I was an adult before understanding how valuable the experience was.  When the church got too big someone would go start a new one. That way everyone knew each other. It is really sad to say but the traditional African American Church has passed away.

  51. KhrystleNichole says:

    “Lack of funding” is code speech for “we don’t want to keep spending our money (tax dollars they have collected) on this “. It the government isn’t making any profit off of it, they have no interest in continuing to invest in it. They have no interest in educating black children. A prison is more profitable. Over half of the children at these schools get free/reduced lunch. Therefore, the government is collecting very little tax dollars in that school district. When the graduation rates drop and the standardized test scores are below national average, they close schools. It’s unfortunate for the children who still attend. How many of these parents get together to home school their kids or start calling and writing their superintendent, school board and city council?

    1. chamberslee says:

      KhrystleNichole 
      We do not know the answer to that question. I do know, however, that the need for both parents to work or the fact that there is only one parent in the home working, prevents home schooling from being a viable option for poor families. Also, daycare costs can eat one’s budget. Read “Nickled and Dime: On Getting by in America” or “Growing Up Poor in America.”  Many poor people are working at least two jobs, which makes attending the PTO or meeting with teachers a challenge. 
      Standardized testing is another discussion, but we know it is useless as a determinate for what students are learning or not learning and how successful a person will be in the future. That is why fewer graduate schools require the GRE, today.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        chamberslee 

        So now most of these people are working?? Why is the black unemployment rate so high if all of these people are working? There are many poor people working 2 jobs. However, with the unemployment being almost 20% in some cities, I don’t think this is the reason that many of the parents in these neighborhoods are not making it to the PTA meetings or meeting with the teachers. The funny thing is you never lay eyes on some of these parents or talk to them over the phone, yet the moment their children are disciplined at school and that child goes home to tell them that a teacher or administrator corrected his/her behavior, suddenly like magic these parents appear ready to kick butt and ask questions later. This just happened 2 weeks ago with a friend of mine who is a high school administrator.
        And no, I’m not an advocate of standardized testing either. I don’t believe they are an accurate measure of ability or knowledge. And that is another conversation. I only mentioned it because it is a factor when political decisions are being made concerning public schools. I know there are reasons that many of the parents are not involved in the education of their children. Some of the reasons are due to public policy and some are due to personal choices.

        1. lionessktty says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee who’s classifying every Black person as poor?  In none of those quotes in the article did the word “Blacks” appear…your mindset alone is a prime example of what Cosby was talking about.  Just because someone says poor, don’t associate that with Black.  
          That said, you are correct in that many of these parents don’t show up until the child is disciplined at school.  It happens all the time, which again goes to Cosby’s point.  All that many of us are saying is, quit blaming the government and do something for yourself.  EVERYTHING starts with personal responsibility, despite what the author seems to think.

        2. Honey Hayes says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee Drop the mic and walk away! (I say that in a good way). You are so on point!

      2. Honey Hayes says:

        chamberslee KhrystleNichole I agree and disagree. If  a child is being raised in a single parent household, there are other options available i.e. phone conference. When a parent(s) is truly interested in their child(s) education, I believe the teacher or school counselor  would be willing to  accommodate them.

    2. Honey Hayes says:

      KhrystleNichole You make a valid point however, how many parents actively participate in their children’s education let alone contact the principal, school board, etc.. How often do they attend parent teacher conferences. I’m not saying all parents are like that… but informed parents are active parents. Both my parents worked when I was in school and my mom is a retired educator… but one or the other attended parent/teacher conferences.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        Honey Hayes I realize there are some parents who work odd shifts, however, you still have to make time. Many teachers will even have a phone conference after hours or even stay late to meet with a parent who shows interest. Some teachers and administrators treat children a lot differently (better) when they know they have concerned and involved parents. It may sound unfair since teachers are expected to be unbiased, but it’s true.

  52. ajamu chaminuka says:

    We all can go back and forth on Cosby and we all make valid points because we’re all concerned. I’m reminded of something Malcolm said: “History is Best Qualified To Reward All Research”! All of us have a responsibility to do more reading and research to understand what is and has happened to us. Including Bill Cosby! My bottom line is that racism/white supremacy put us where we are but it’s on us to get out from Under BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY!

  53. MicheleLoving says:

    Blah blah blah.  “I’m looking at the MAN or Wo-MaN in the mirror, I’m asking him to change his ways”–Michael Jackson.
    Enough said.
    Can the statistics, stop making excuses for blacks, whites, and others for not doing what the hell they are suppose to be doing!!  But you condemn people who did something about their own lives, who marched, who conquered, who trail blazed, who were called N*gger in their face.  You dare to criticize them. Until you live a day in their shoes, you will never know.  
    How dare you?  How DARE YOU?  
    Ya know its like this, I got pregnant at 18, the father knew, admitted and told me don’t worry about a thing, I got you.  He went into the Army, his mother got in contact with me and told me that he denied being the father. Called me every slut and ho’.  For twenty two years, he nor his parents laid eyes on my son.  And this year, he died from an aortic dissection.  My son has two sisters didn’t know he had and met his paternal grandparents at the memorial service.   Has he heard from them since: NO!!!   I fought and made sure he had medical through the Army, had privileges on base under his father.  I didn’t play when it came down to child support, you want to not be there emotionally, physically, and mentally, then I am going to get you financially. Through it all, my son is a college graduate, Army Reservist, an NCO, and will be a first time dad in a few months..  I got married for the first time three years ago, to a man with a brain injury he sustained at 17.  He is a loving man.  Capable of anything and everything.  I am in the system once again, I have to report my wages that will effect his SSI check. Which will effect our household.  I work with Special Education students with Baltimore City Schools, I see what No child left behind is really doing to our children and work in child care too.  A total of 16 years teaching and caring for children.   I meet people everyday on the bus, at the store, or wherever I may be at the time.  I advise, consult, teach, preach, pastor, and tell them where, when, how, and what they can do to better themselves based on MY experiences and knowledge.   “YOU can NOT lead a horse to the water, if THEY are NOT THIRSTY: to WANT MORE FOR THEMSELVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Rather settle for less.   
    Don’t complain about policy and a change is gonna come and DON”T VOTE.  Don’t complain about the children on the bus cursing and being disrespectful and your own children do it too.  IT starts AT HOME!!
    I admire Cosby, he has been there and done that, as a BLACK MAN, A COON, A N*GGER, A COLORED, he has been called worse in America!!  Give him RESPECT and others, Jesse, Maya, Cicely, Oprah, read their stories, and then complain, comment or whatever.
    I am going to kiss my husband and go to work, and sit on the floor and sing, “There are 7 days in a week” with my day care kids.    Peace and Blessings

    1. CarolParks says:

      Michele! Wow! God Bless You! Your post blew me away! Now you are a fighter, and no one could ever keep you down. You are a very Impressive Lady. I wish that you, & some other very impressive people on here, were running our Gov. Instead of the crooks we have now. Not President Obama, I trust him. But, your very powerful, & emotional post is just Awesome! Again, God Bless You, & Your Whole Family! & Congratulation’s on your marriage, & your new grand baby! I think you should receive a Mother Of The Year Award! Great people posting on here!

      1. ajamu chaminuka says:

        CarolParks If you trust Obomber then you must need your head examined or you need to Watch more democracy now or something other than where you’re getting your info from!

      2. ajamu chaminuka says:

        CarolParks Yes, you trust Obomber because you are not victimized by the system the way Africans have been since this country was founded. Black people voted for Obomber overwhelmingly and what have we gotten?  You agree with Michele and i respect her struggles but she’s one person. How high would she have gone without racism/white supremacy holding her back? The same for many others who have succeeded, how high would they have gone in a fair society. But it’s on Black people to destroy that which holds the majority of us back. And i’m sure you would not support what we will have to do to get justice in america. America will have to be taken down before a more just society can be built. Are you down with that?

        1. CarolParks says:

          You have asked me twice now on President Obama, well it is NOT the subject at hand. But, below will tell you what he has done to help the poor, middle class, & the AA community who is affected by these programs. ESPECIALLY The Affordable Health Care Act, which will help everyone who needs a Dr. and get the help that they need. Not to forget DETROIT, and all the thousands of jobs that were saved by preventing the Auto Industry from collapsing and all the business’s across the country that are affiliated with it.
          One more thing, he tried to pass The JOBS ACT in 2011, but CONGRESS said NO. It would have provided thousands of jobs across the country in CONSTRUCTION rebuilding roads, bridges, and infrastructure. In every state in the nation. Yes, this would have helped AA, and everyone else for that matter.
          Here’s a List of 2012 Obama Accomplishments, With Citations! (*Please… Cut the Crap)
          Pass this list around to everyone you know who whines that Obama’s done nothing. Then note that a large proportion of these accomplishments came with a Democratic Congress, and if they want more, they’ll have to help him achieve it. And if anyone tries to claim this is all bunk, point out that, unlike many such lists, every item includes a citation supporting it.
          201. Appointed the most diverse Cabinet in history, including more women than any other incoming president. http://bit.ly/dX6vNB
          208. Signed an Executive Order pledging support for efforts to end the global problem of violence against women and girls. http://1.usa.gov/MHTRVU
          209. Signed the Claims Resolution Act, which provided $4.6 billion in funding for a legal settlement with black and Native American farmers who had been cheated out of government loans and natural resource royalties in the past. http://1.usa.gov/dGppUa
          57. Wrote and signed an Executive Order establishing a White House Council on Women and Girls to ensure that all Cabinet and Cabinet-level agencies evaluate the effect of their policies and programs on women and families. http://bit.ly/e1puTk http://1.usa.gov/rFfqMM
          58. Signed the Democratic-sponsored Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, which restored basic protections against pay discrimination for women and other workers. This was after the GOP blocked the bill in 2007. Only 5 Republican Senators voted for the bill. http://bit.ly/fT3Cxg
          59. Expanded funding for the Violence Against Women Act. http://1.usa.gov/dSbI0x
          60. Under his guidance, National Labor Relations Board issued final rules that require all employers to prominently post employees’ rights where all employees or prospective employees can see it, including websites and intranets, beginning November 2011. http://1.usa.gov/qu2EhQ
          This fight is not over. We can’t allow 2014 to be like 2010.

        2. CarolParks says:

          Here is the link, the list is too long to put here.
          Here’s a List of 212 Obama Accomplishments, With Citations! (*Please… Cut the Crap)
          You can copy & paste it into your browser if you need to.

        3. CarolParks says:

          ajamu chaminuka I am down with Everyone demanding a new political party that is not corrupt, and that no one serves more then 4 years. I am for people demanding a New Legal System that is fair to everyone, and that the Prisons For Profit will have a complete do- over. I am for our Gov. To reflect all the different cultures living in our country instead of this 90% all White Gov. And not just all cultures, but to include women also. I am for making weed legal, so 1/2, the Prisons will empty. And to use the profits to rebuild our country and invest in jobs. To also invest in education, and better schools in poorer neighborhoods. I am for putting the Truth in our history books, as to what really happened in America. Everyone should have the same opportunities, and the same access to good schools, medical care, and fresh fruit & produce in Every Neighborhood in this country. And I am for stopping Gangs. To have more Jobs Programs, and actual jobs in poorer neighborhoods, & daycare centers. And parks, playgrounds, etc. that is what I stand for.

    2. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

      MicheleLoving Thank you Michele.  Enough said.

    3. bwdn2008 says:

      MicheleLoving Yes and his son was killed by a White man, but he still vilifies poor blacks. We all have our individual stories of success that does not change the fact that many are still living in poverty and ignorance. Some of us are so brainwashed that we treat the white man as if HE is God. We want to emulate him like any prisoner of war does. It is called the, “Stockholm Syndrome” when prisoners were so beaten down and abused they struck out and each other. They saw those abusing them as some sort of savior. Some African Americans have put the white man’s materialism in front of God. Anyone who does not wear Gucci, Prada, drive a Cadillac or Mercedes, has not made it! It is a death of the Spirit in a people who are descendants of the oldest humans walking this planet.

  54. TalithaMcEachin says:

    Hmmmm Yvette Carnell as a former, private math tutor I have to agree with him on parental involvement in schools because that was my experience as well. I do agree with you otherwise though. It is very condescending, just like Obama.

    1. Honey Hayes says:

      TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell I respect your opinion however, this blog is not about President Obama

      1. ajamu chaminuka says:

        Honey Hayes TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell It may not be directly about Obomber but the point is relevant. There are those who have suceeded in part because of the Black struggle then come back and berate those left behind. And i bet you support Obomber who also berates in a condescending manner but has done nothing for Black people even while he got all our votes. If a man has his foot on my neck, yes it’s on me to remove his foot by any means necessary but that doesn’t absolve him from having me down!

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          ajamu chaminuka Honey Hayes TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell Amen!

        2. CarolParks says:

          ajamu chaminuka Honey Hayes TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell  So, you would have liked Mitt RobMe to have won? Really? LOL!

        3. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks ajamu chaminuka Honey Hayes TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell And what difference would it have made for us, It was Lyndon Johnson, that racist cracker from Texas who did the most for Black people. The lesser of two evils is not good enough!

        4. CarolParks says:

          I agree. But, President Obama is not your enemy, CONGRESS is. They stopped a lot of progress, and programs that would have done so much for not only AA, but everyone. Please read the statement that I posted on here, and use the link for the whole list of what This President has actually done. Not opinions, but fact’s, laws and Bills, and programs that were passed.He has done much more then you realize. But, you are very correct about our Gov., and how unfair, unjust, and even criminally they have gone against AA, and at points in our history tried to destroy AA. Tuskegee experiments, Black Wall Street, deliberately bringing in drugs to poor neighborhoods, during the 1930’s. and the list goes on, as I am sure you know. The problem is most of White America does not know.

        5. CarolParks says:

          I see you have ignored my reply to your question about what has President Obama done for AA? Very convenient for you I must say. It’s on here, a very long list of what he has actually done. Check it out the reply is under your name. Ajamu chaminuka. And by the way, why are you giving the GOP a free pass when it is Congress who must first pass the bills?

      2. TalithaMcEachin says:

        Honey Hayes TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell It doesn’t have to be I simply drew a parallel between Cosby’s speeches directed towards the black community and Obama’s. The similarity is striking to ME.

    2. TalithaMcEachin Yvette Carnell We could use more parental involvement across the board. Don’t pigeon hole it and make it a black thing.

      1. TalithaMcEachin says:

        Yvette Carnell TalithaMcEachin Yvette while that’s true I was speaking of my experiences though & it wasn’t the same when I tutored for white families (if I’m remembering the context correctly). There was a distinct difference, although parental involvement does need to increase across the board.

      2. JustOneWoman says:

        Yvette Carnell TalithaMcEachin   Pigeon hole? With me, I’m not about the ‘White thing.’  I’m about the Black thing.  And not Black-as-opposed-to-White thing.  I am about addressing my/our problems. Whatever they may be.  Whether they are shared by  other races, mainstream, whatever.  Because one focuses on oneself does not necessarily imply pigeon holing.

  55. JustOneWoman says:

    I don’t think it’s condescending at all. We are inclined to think of it as condescending because WE think that he thinks he’s in a different category.  Because WE think that he IS  in a different category. And/or because we define ourselves by where we live and by our ‘predicament.’  And thus we assume everyone else is doing the same thing.  If I cannot honestly address you as you are, then you are living a lie.  We are always judging people by what we attribute to them, forsaking all truth.  And for Yvette, we understand how government has shaped and aligned our predicament.  I’m sure that Bill knows and understands this also.  That alignment does not negate the need for personal involvement and responsibility.  Once I acknowledge the negativity of my position, it is then my duty  to change that factor on any level that I can.  Not to succumb to it. Is it Nas of 50 cents who said ‘the ghetto is not a place to glorify or seek to stay.  You are supposed to uplift from that point.’  Ad libbing.  And you don’t have actually physically leave your environment to uplift from it. Some may never be financially able. And I’m not saying anything akin to being ‘too good’ for the ghetto or so-called Black environment. I’m saying that it’s supposed to be a temporary tide-me-over situation. The institution of the projects and/or low-income housing and assistance was to provide assistance until the family was able to ‘get on their feet.’  So Yvette, your line of argument is saying that because of the government, you cannot raise a righteous child  yourself.  And especially not a poor, Black, and/or disenfranchised mother. Because poor people are incapable of ethics when caught between a rock and a hard place. Because the disenfranchised no nothing of morals other than what is provided by open government. And a Black woman definitely cannot be as good of a mother as a White sister or a woman of ‘means.’  Here’s a pun – it doesn’t take money to make you do your job as a parent or as a person.

    1. JustOneWoman I don’t know what Cosby understands about how gov’t shapes our predicament since it is rarely mentioned in his critique. When he mentioned Republicans awhile back, his comments were mostly centered on racism within the Party, but that wasn’t a thoughtful critique of how race permeates public policy. It was, at  heart, mostly cultural.

      1. JustOneWoman says:

        Yvette Carnell JustOneWoman  You know, some things (in conversation) are a given.  Or else we will stagnate on nit-picking the ‘assumed’ outlines of a situation.  We can discuss the perimeters and parameters if you would like.  The gov’t plays a part in the Black situation.  A HUGE part.  But now that that is done, I, here in the ghetto, am left with my situation.  And it is indeed MY situation.  No matter how I got here. And in My situation, it is I and only I whom must address it and conquer it for me.  Not saying that other elements of progression and assistance should not be working also.  But I and MY situation is my concern and I will conquer what I am and where I am no matter what forces act in opposition to me. And the same way that you say that you don’t know what Cosby understands about the gov’t/predicament because he has never commented, is the exact same argument that says that you cannot critique or criticize him for his position or knowledge of it. Let me qualify this next statement by saying that not only must we work on an individual level but also as a cohesive unit against our oppressor….  Statement; if someone will go beyond the metaphors, the right-wing left-wing snippets, cut thru the govt’ which will take an eon to fix – and will hit you in your knees, take it to your heart, and parlay with you n in-the-trenches jargon.  Someone who says cut the bs and let’s get down to work on this thing.  I take my hat off to Bill.  Consider how many times someone has told you the absolute truth, especially about yourself.  The average ‘how-do-you-do’ conversation is bs and hypocrisy speaking civilized because I am ‘civilized’ when ‘civilized’ is something put on man’s actual nature so that he can get along with the next one. If someone tells you the truth, accept I.  L:ater for where you think he’s coming from.  And then be honest with yourself.  That’s the hardest part for anyone whom is not living their life to the fullest.

        1. chamberslee says:

          JustOneWoman Yvette Carnell 
          There are two issues being discussed here: individual responsibility and social structures. One has to be more important than the other in terms of improving poor black communities. I just gave away the answer. There must be a structural approach when addressing a marco issue such as improving communities. At the family and individual level, a micro approach is necessary to address individual issues. In other words, to do the greatest good and have far reaching effects and benefits, we need to focus on structural issues to reform and enact new policies to improve education, employment opportunities, affordable and healthy housing, reduce the prison industrial complex, community vitalization without dislocation of poor black residents, and so forth. 
          To use the analogy of improving health through exercise and diet: both diet and exercise are important but diet is the most important aspect of losing weight and reducing comorbidity and mortality rates among overweight and obese people. Focusing on exercise without making fundamental changes in diet will equal failure. The same is true when looking at social structures and individual responsibility. If there is no policy reform or enactment, person responsibility will not have a positive impact on the vast majority–only a few will realize upward mobility.    
          Dyson (2005) documents the unequal funding of education that prevents poor urban blacks from competing on an equal playing field white and black middle class suburban students. To be clear, earning an A in most urban schools is not the same as earning an A in suburban schools. Schools are funded, in part, through property taxes; therefore, you will have a better funded school in the suburbs than in urban environments: cutting edge technology, better qualified teachers, smaller classrooms, updated books that students can actually take home to use for studying. In urban schools, technology is the bare minimum or nonexistent (Dyson, 2005). This a structural issue that requires policy reform along with individual responsibility to organize and demand reform. 
          References 
          Dyson, M.E. (2005). Is Bill Cosby right?: Or has the black middle class lost its mind? New York, New York: Basic Civitas Books.

        2. JustOneWoman says:

          chamberslee JustOneWoman Yvette Carnell  I agree.  I was just a little irked  by the inability to see the truth in the man’s words.  Before Cosby even opened his mouth, people judged him because of his money.  Quest for the truth doesn’t work like that.

  56. bwdn2008 says:

    Here is a economic reality. Most of the workers in Urban Areas are whites from the Suburbs. They take their paychecks and improve their own communities. Some on this site seem to suggest that Blacks should repair their streets, fix buildings they are living in, repair roads, streets, and generally clean up Urban Blight, all with no money. Living in Urban Areas is more expensive than living in the Suburbs. That is the economic reality that no one is talking about.

    1. KhrystleNichole says:

      bwdn2008 All things need repair and updating over time with ordinary use. It takes money to repair these things. There are many people who live in poor communities who take care of what little they do have. But here is where it gets hard. Those “few” who decide not to care, litter trash along the streets. They allow their kids to throw rocks and break windows. They write graffiti all over the buildings and walls. They urinate in the stairwells. These are examples of things I have seen within some of the poor communities. Now I have actually seen some low income communities that were so clean and well kept that you wouldn’t even know it was low income housing by the looks of it, since it does not fit the stereotypical low income housing community. Now what is the difference between the 2 communities? I’d say that more people probably care in the latter. Some people think you have to have something really expensive and fine in order to treat it with care. If you can’t take care of something small, why would anyone think you would take care of something big? Earlier I talked about tax dollars. So yes the reality is that because the government is not collecting much revenue from the people in these communities, they are not going to make fixing the roads, sidewalks and buildings that fall into disrepair a priority. You can see how this plays out when you venture over to the more affluent part of any urban area. Remember, it’s all about the $$$. When black people start to realize that, maybe we can stop scratching our heads and itching about why the government hasn’t done this or that for our community. This is a capitalistic not a socialist country. Don’t ever be fooled by either political party to think that it’s not.

      1. bwdn2008 says:

        KhrystleNichole bwdn2008 I guess you have not spent any time around white kids, Asian kids or Hispanic kids. So like many folks, you are getting your information on black life from the Media? Have you been to a trailer park? Have you been to the barrio? Why are you posting as if this is a problem endemic to blacks? The children you are talking about may have parents that are on drugs. There are white folks on drugs and Hispanic folks on drugs. There use to be programs for drug addicts but they have all but ended. I live near a city in which 27% of the inhabitants are African American, about 23% Hispanic, 20% Asian and the rest are white. I don’t see a black neighborhood as there are whites, Hispanics, and Asians in all of the neighborhood. I know that when the Vietnamese like to raise chickens and ducks, and eat them fresh. So they kill the animals and hang them on their patio where ever they live. I have seen Asians hanging sheets outside and living with 10 or more people in their places. There are Asian Gangs, Hispanic Gangs, and white Gangs (the Hells Angels for One). Maybe you see it too but are busy recording what black folks do. The media does little reporting about what goes on in the trailer parks with drugs, incest, and violence. Unfortunately for African Americans the same people who sent them to Urban Areas in the first place, are ready to move back. Now we have the Gentrification of Urban Neighborhoods and the moving in of white, “LIBERALS.” Which make me wonder if you yourself are African American or just posing!

        1. KhrystleNichole says:

          bwdn2008 I am basically talking about the fact that blacks do not seek economic power. When you have economic power, you can demand that your streets and roads are repaired and that you have access to services in your community. You might want to check out this article to get an idea of what I’m talking about. 
          http://www.finalcall.com/artman/publish/Business_amp_Money_12/article_9721.shtml

        2. bwdn2008 says:

          KhrystleNicholebwdn2008Did anyone take note that Whistle blower, Edward Snowden is a high school dropout, who was making about $200,000 a year? There are black folks with Degrees who cannot get jobs paying that much. I know that my son-in-law who has an MBA is not making that much. My daughter who has a Masters in Accounting Administration does not make nearly that much. Are there any Black folks running business like the one Snowden Contracted with? If there are they are few and far between. Most of the big businesses in the US depended at one time or another, on Government Loans to function. Those loans are not available for the average black person, but it is our tax-dollars that are used to fund these businesses. Bill Cosby’s career boost was a direct result of the Civil Rights Movement and the struggle for black folks to have equal rights. Harry Belafonte and Sidney Poitier, Dick Gregory, Ruby and Ossie, and many more were out there marching with us. They were fighting not just for Justice but access to the same economic access whites take for granted. Instead our neighborhoods were flooded with drugs and guns, while employment opportunity dried up. So yes there are some folks who fell prey to that and did not see it coming. But who am I to judge? There but for the Grace of God go I!

        3. CarolParks says:

          I am not in your conversation. But, I would like to say that in any discussion, you should never personally attack anyone. Just keep it to the subject at hand. Once you start personal attacks you have already lost any credibility. Being civil is the standard in any debate.

        4. CarolParks says:

          To be clear, my comment was for bwdn2008.

        5. TalithaMcEachin says:

          CarolParks Agreed. Also, anytime you post a comment publicly on a forum such as this there’s no privacy & anyone commenting is fair game.

        6. CarolParks says:

          Hi Talitha, yes, that is true. The attack was not against me, but someone else posting on here. Personal attacks are always wrong, and bring nothing to the debate.

        7. Honey Hayes says:

          CarolParks So true, mature adults should be able to hold an intelligent conversation and we can agree to disagree. Its all about respect

        8. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole 
          I wrote about Snowden and black hiring  discrimination and you nailed it. You are also right about the average black person not having access to the capital needed to start or expand businesses. I read an article a few years ago about a white teen who started a successful business and became a millionaire many times over. But see received a $250,000 loan from her older brother to get started. Another example is the recent settlement for black farmers who lost their businesses due to unfair practices where they were denied the same loans and subsidies white farmer were awarded. Finally, many of the government contracts go to the same established companies in a very closed process that does not allow others to have a fair chance to compete.

        9. CarolParks says:

          Honey Hayes CarolParks  Absolutely! 😀

        10. CarolParks says:

          Honey Hayes CarolParks  Absolutely! 😀

        11. bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole Excellent point about Snowden… same thing for Silicon Valley, where much of the research that buttresses its technology boom is provided by tax dollars, but you wouldn’t know it by how those techies are exalted by media and other thought leaders in our culture.

        12. JustOneWoman says:

          Honey Hayes CarolParks I like your statement.  I can’t stand that phrase ‘agree to disagree.’  It doesn’t fit for everything.  The purpose of argumentation and debate is to get to an irrefutable truth.  If we agree to disagree on a truth, the one of us has gotten it wrong. ijs.

        13. whitebl09 says:

          chamberslee bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole That is actually untrue and I can tell you this because I know from first hand experience of government contracts. I can’t speak for farmers but I know how it works for technology. You submit a proposal and the proposal has to align with the needs at the time for whatever agency you are submitting with. Also, women owned and minority owned businesses could be a plus in your favor depending on the type of proposal

        14. whitebl09 says:

          Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole Why is that tax dollars comment relavent? If Silicon Valley was getting all of this money from the government it is because the government was getting return on its investment in the form of some type of state of the art communication devices, computes, weapons, any thing you can imagine. You talk like there’s some type of conspiracy or something. You saw how great the iPhone was when it came out lol. Seriously though, going to college is not about getting a degree.. It’s about going to gain knowledge and finding a job. So many people go to school and get degrees but don’t have a plan for those degrees. They pick a major and try to find a career in that major instead of picking a career and charting the path to that career

        15. chamberslee says:

          whitebl09 Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole 
          First, the government spends billions on military weapons and often get little in return–not all the time but often. There are military jets the government has paid billions for that have never flown a mission–ever. By the time they were finished, the technology was considered outdated. This happens often. Basically, the government is keeping money in the coffers of companies that have guaranteed no bid contracts. 
          As for education, I do not believe a black high school dropout could get a job at the FBI, no matter how smart he or she is with computers. In fact, study after study show that white high school dropouts with a criminal record are more likely to get the job when going against a black college graduate with no criminal record. That is still true in America, today.

        16. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee whitebl09 Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole It is true. So is the argument that we should be able to drop out of school and get a job at the FBI too? As I said, at first we were fighting for rights that were unquestionably our birth right. Now we’re arguing for the right to be just as messed up as some white people and come out on top. For real??

        17. whitebl09 says:

          chamberslee whitebl09 Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole That’s not technology development. At that point the technology is already developed and it doesn’t cost as much to make more jets. This sometimes happens when DoD spending is high and there is a need for jobs because this is a way to keep lower paying manufacturing jobs. Also, no one, Black or White could get a job with the FBI and be a drop out unless they went back, got their diploma, degree and paperwork right. Because unless there are extreme circumstances where there is absolutely no one else who can do the job for you.. you can not get a job with the FBI or any government agency with no credentials. PERIOD

        18. CarolParks says:

          Bingo! Right on point. I live close to Silicone Valley. And anyone with “tech” knowledge is hired. I believe, but am not sure on the percentage that about 30 to 35% are AA employed there. We also have Facebook, Twitter, and Google here. You can make excellent wages with benefits here. We are booming with jobs, here and all over the Bay Area. Construction is booming also, with the new Niner Stadium being built, the work on the Bay Bridge, and the new Golden State Warrior stadium being built. Plus, we have a new Indian Casino that was just built in the North Bay, Rohnert Park, offering 2,000 jobs, with training, good wages, and benefits. The economy is soaring here right now.

        19. CarolParks says:

          The Silicone Valley with the Tech jobs, is the most important job right now in this country that affects almost everything you can think of. The latest technology for cars, planes, weapons, appliances, computers, phones, Government Programs, Military, etc… That is why people are well paid there. The most advanced systems in the world, rely on technology. Including anything to do with the Space Program.

        20. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks I live near the Silicone Valley and most of the workers there (other then whites) are Asian or Contract Workers from India. They will hire Ethiopians before hiring African Americans. There is not 30% of AA working in Silicone Valley unless it just happened today. We are talking not just about jobs but being Entrepreneurs and owning our own businesses.

        21. CarolParks says:

          I have friends working there and my friends are AA. They gave me the impression quite a few of the employees are AA. I live in S. F., and I know there are also a lot of Asians working there . That is not surprising as they are usually very “tech” savvy. Anyone who is tech savvy I am sure they will hire. I believe that it is very important to have AA own their own business’s. And that everyone should support that. There are several AA business’s that I support on a regular basis, including a restaurant. I believe this is a great area where everyone can thrive. Especially, with all the jobs available.

        22. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee whitebl09 Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 
          What are you talking about? No one said or implied any such thing about it being OK to dropout of school like Snowden, or any white person, and get a job at the FBI. You made that up. You are sounding more like you work for FOX–when you cannot dispute the facts, just twist the information or make it up. There is an essay titled. “How to Say Nothing in 500 Words,” and you are nailing it. Instead of having an intelligent discussion where you allow yourself to see  the facts or use objective information and facts of your own to counter my statements, you say the most incredulous things.   
          You never address the facts. Please, address school underfunding and closures and tell my why demanding policy reform is not the appropriate response?

        23. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks I think i’ve tried to give you my point of view on some issues here. If you’re interested in understanding more, i express views on facebook under my name   ajamu chaminuka

        24. chamberslee says:

          whitebl09 chamberslee Yvette Carnell bwdn2008 KhrystleNichole 
          Snowden got a job with the FBI after obtaining a GED. My point is that a black person with a GED would not have the same luck and I base that on the studies that have shown this to be the case. This fact is why affirmative action was enacted.

        25. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          Carol, you have good intentions, but you are missing a great deal of understanding about how race is lived in America (an actual book title), which skews your view of black employment, mobility and barriers.
          First,  having AA friends working in Silicone Valley doesn’t mean most qualified blacks will be hired because companies are hiring.  And I do not know where you got that 30- 35 percent number from. A simple Google search shows most influential  fortune 500 and small businesses lack diversity, some severely: especially blacks, Latinos and women. In fact, articles point out that many Silicone Valley companies do not want to share data on their employee diversity. Is it because they do not have appropriate levels of diversity. You the know the answer.
          Second, African Americans wanting to start or expand a business find it difficult to impossible to access the necessary capital. The articles I found suggest that office space in Silicone Valley is some of the most expensive in the country. Then there is the issue of affordable housing that is a barrier for most blacks wanting to relocate to Silicone Valley. Equally important is Silicone Valley residents who do not want too many blacks living in their communities. Research shows that white flight is likely when about 10 percent of the community becomes black. The fear is that crime is going to increase or their property value will be negatively affected. Shopping or eating in black owned establishments is admirable but is not addressing the problem: access to capital. 
          Finally, there are too few jobs in inner cities where they are needed. Silicone Valley is not an open system because it is not accepting  of or affordable for poor and middle class blacks.

        26. CarolParks says:

          Hi chamberslee, I am sorry you misunderstood my post. First, I do not live in the Simi Valley. I live in San Francisco, where I was born. And I grew up, and still live in a very diverse neighborhood. AA, Palestinian, Asian, Hispanic, & others, are my neighbors, and friends. I really do not know that much about Simi Valley, except that they have lots of jobs. I do have AA friends who work there, two at Google. The way they were talking it sounded like there was a fair amount of AA working in the different business’s there. I also had pointed out, there was a lot of construction jobs here in the Bay Area. The Niner Stadium, Bay Area Bridge, & the new GG Warrior stadium. And we have a new, huge Indian Casino, that is hiring, & training for 2,000 jobs. It’s in a city called Rohnert Park, about 40 minutes from Oakland. So, my point was there are a lot of jobs here right now. Many people live in cheaper areas, and take Bart, or just drive to work. Some people actually, drive a hour and a half to and from work everyday. Not me, never! Lol! But, there is opportunity here right now. It is very expensive here in the Bay Area, no doubt about that. Silicone Valley, has always been known to be racist, I agree. But, a few people are telling me, that mostly young people work at Google, Facebook, Twitter, etc. And that they are not racist. I tend to believe that, as we are known to be very accepting of everyone here, and very laid back. Many people that I have personally met, have said they love the freedom here to just be yourself. No one bothers you, nor pays much attention. We are extremely diverse in the Bay Area. And I believe we got our laid back reputation back in the 1960’s, with the Hippie movement. Anyway, I love it here, it’s really beautiful.
          The White Flight I don’t see here. Our neighborhoods are really mixed. We also have a big population of IR couples and children. A lot of younger people, and older too, live together, and don’t get married like a long time ago. So statistics are very unreliable when trying to figure out the data on marriages.
          Oh, and most younger people do not live in Silicone Valley if they do work there. Instead they live in cities, or towns nearby which are cheaper.
          Yes, getting a business started is no easy task, especially for AA. I’m not sure if you read my post, about how to take the power back, & demand to have your issues heard. It’s on here somewhere. And, it’s proving to be successful. Anyway, I love discussion, especially if it leads to a solution, even partly that can address problems. Have a lovely evening. 🙂

        27. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks You are avoiding words like Gentrification and Guest Workers. You know in any discussion those are two important words. My friends in Hunters point are being displaced from Neighborhoods they have lived in for generations. You see they are tearing down the apartments where these people live and building million dollar homes for those Silicon Valley Executives who have so many jobs. The other word is Guest Workers, you know the ones they bring in from India and Asia to work for low wages. Did you miss that part? I have been in the Fillmore District, Hunters Point, and Mission District where blacks and Hispanics are being displaced so that the Wealthy Millionaires from Silicone Valley can live there. That is what is really going on in San Francisco. Also, I see a lot of Construction in fact we picketed a Construction site which refused to hire blacks. Most of these companies are from out of State and bring their own, mostly white crew. They also like to have undocumented workers who they pay low wages and no benefits to. I believe you just don’t know or understand that those Company’s do not want to Hire anyone permanently. They will close down and move overseas at the drop of a hat. Apple, Google, Facebook, Yahoo all of those start-ups part of the Capitalist System in which they get rich and workers stay poor!

      2. Honey Hayes says:

        KhrystleNichole bwdn2008  You are so right…political affiliation does not determine right or wrong as relates to having pride and respect for your community. We need to reevaluate our local representation from the Alderman/Councilman to the Governor. Federal money is allocated to every  a state… but how is it disbursed? Where is the accountability and why aren’t people aware of the money paid/given under the table. Why do we continue to vote on the local level for individuals (some not all) that are not sincerely concerned and continue to misinformed the public. WHY….because they are sold out, they want what they think is a prestigious position,  they secretly still monies allocated for improvements, housing grants etc. and they bask in their own glory.

  57. darkmonte says:

    A horrible article from start to finish! If you are able to feel shame you should be a shame of yourself.  Zero respect for a man who has done so much for his people, and the blatant disrespect, and name calling just turned me off to whatever this “writer” was attempting to convey.

  58. Honey Hayes says:

    While everyone is entitled to their opinion, I’m a little concerned with the article. Whether I agree or not with what Mr. Cosby stated , the real question for me would be why are some people able to rise above poverty and their circumstances and others are not. There is nothing wrong with our government offering temporary assistance to people regardless of color but as a black woman, how long are we going to blame the government for not having a better job, better education for our children, safe neighborhoods/communities etc….WHEN are we going to not only rise above the situation and also take heed to the advise others share that have conquered the demon of poverty. WHEN are we willing to except constructive criticism and move forward. WHEN are we going to remember that many gave their lives for many of the liberties we have today. WHEN are we going to stop crawling and walk. WHEN are we going to take responsibility for where we live by participating and insisting it is kept safe and clean. WHEN are we going to be concerned about the senseless killing in our communities. WHEN are we going to show respect for the elderly and each other. WHEN WHEN WHEN

    1. KhrystleNichole says:

      Honey Hayes Exactly!!

    2. CarolParks says:

      Honey Hayes, with your powerful voice, I see another community Leader! Anything is possible, if people believe, and have inner strength.

      1. Honey Hayes says:

        CarolParks  Thanks for the compliment and admittedly I have thought about in the past… its just way too much corruption involved. But I don’t mind sharing the wisdom God has given me. Who knows what he has in store for me 🙂

        1. CarolParks says:

          Every community needs a leader to address the unique problems in that community, and to have that community stand together against injustice. You would be excellent!

        2. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          No, she would not be a great leader because she views the issues from a simplistic standpoint and that is not what the black community needs. The issues in the black community are due to policies and practices that have occurred over generations and are still affecting black communities, today. Cosby is simplistic and he has nothing to say that is useful in black communities. He sounds too much like Rush Limbaugh and that sums it up. Read “Is Bill Cosby Right? Or has the Black Middle Class Lost Its Mind?” for real insight and understanding, as Dr. Dyson answers Cosby’s tirades with historic and empirical facts.

    3. DebraMcAllisterSlaughter says:

      Honey Hayes Thank you for voicing this so eloquently! I also would like to know, WHEN are we going to stop criticizing other Blacks for speaking the truth, and referring to us as Uncle Toms.  Mr. Cosby is on point with his observations, and the writer of this piece should be applauding him for speaking out, instead of the reverse.

      1. Honey Hayes says:

        DebraMcAllisterSlaughter Honey Hayes  I agree Debra but there will unfortunately always be a negative voice to a positive stand.

    4. chamberslee says:

      Honey Hayes 
      Constrictive criticism is when one is presenting facts and solutions to the problem being critiqued. Cosby is doing neither. He relies on racial stereotypes, over generalizations and right-wing talking points that are designed to distract from the real issue. You are referring to micro issues at the individual level. I, on the other hand, am talking about macro issues that affect policy, institutions and communities. That is the difference and why we may never have the discussion that is needed. 
      I grew up in the projects and was the first one in my family to go to college. I attend some of the country’s best universities and earned two graduate degrees. My experience has taught me that getting out of poverty requires hard work, luck and policy reform that makes it easier and more likely larger numbers of poor black people will have an opportunity to improve their situation. I am disappointed when I see people who made it out of the hood attack the ones who were not as fortunate. Elitism appears to be another issue that divides the black community and prevents us from seeing that we are connected in the desire to achieve a comfortable existence.

      1. KhrystleNichole says:

        chamberslee It’s funny that you mention your accomplishments in singular form and not plural. You state here  “I attended some the country’s best universities”. It seems that you attribute part of your own success to hard work and luck. Is there something more special and unique about you than thousands of other black people? Something that would make it possible for YOU to have the opportunity to work hard and earn degrees and get out of poverty but this opportunity is not available to most others? When are black politicos going to start telling poor black people the TRUTH?!  When are you all going to stop playing to a political agenda? You’re no better than the right wing when you keep trying to lead black people through the clouds. Elitism? Who’s being elite when in other words you tell people how you were so special and privileged that YOU earned two masters degrees but unfortunately the other poor black people can’t do it until Washington changes some policies for poor black people. If individual efforts mean very little, yet YOU were able to change your own individual situation, then I guess that would make you just lucky and special!

        1. KhrystleNicholechamberslee
          “When are black politicos going to start telling poor black people the TRUTH?!”
          The truth according to who? You? Mr. Cosby?

        2. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee
          You are good at taking things out of context rather than responding to the entire statement. Why would I use a plural when referencing my experience. That is nonsense. My point is that I come from a poor black community but I have not gotten too big that I cannot see the real issues that need addressing in working class and poor black communities. Too many black people make it and then attack those who are left behind instead of looking at policies that make it extremely difficult for them to make it out. Despite my achievements, I have made a conscientious effort to be honest and look at all factors and determine what is most needed to bring about change–to give the discussion the complexity it deserves instead of tired right wing poppycock.  
          Instead of looking certain statements you can attack, address the main points: policy versus individual responsibility and why Cosby is simplistic and stereotypical in his admonishments. Tell my, using facts, why they are wrong. That would be refreshing.

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee KhrystleNichole My daughter and son-in-law both have advanced degrees and are helping others where they live. I met some wonderful people who are educated and some who are not who care about the community. It is sad to see so many of our folks who lack empathy. I see black folks who brag about being raised on welfare, and having made it out, are working against their own people. Most of us are just one or two paychecks away from being hungry and homeless. That is the reality.

        4. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee I didn’t take anything out of context. I repeated what you said. The reason I pointed out your singular use when stating your accomplishments is because you adamantly state that individual achievement has very little to do with blacks becoming more successful as a group. What you’re not talking about is what specific things you did and what things you did not do to accomplish these things. Let’s be honest, you don’t become successful, at least most people don’t, by not doing or doing certain things. There are certain things that usually make success possible and other things that are roadblocks, of individual choice to success. You can keep denying this for the sake of your argument all you want. Quite honestly some of it is simplistic. It doesn’t take rocket science to figure out if you drop out of school, have several kids, get hooked on drugs, and whatever other vice you can get into, most likely you will remain poor. Of course this doesn’t apply to all poor black people. But the ones who are guilty of this behavior need to be told that this is part of the reason why they are still living in poverty. I am very sick of seeing my brothers and sisters go down this road! To blame public policy for drinking, drugging, thugging, robbing and killing is b.s. Sorry, I can’t coddle and sidestep this issue.

        5. KhrystleNichole says:

          Yvette Carnell  chamberslee The truth about why some black people are poor. It’s not MY truth or Mr. Cosby’s truth. The truth be told, Mr. Cosby doesn’t really have to say a word to or about black people. He has his money and doesn’t live in the ghetto. At the end of the day it really doesn’t matter if you and however many poor black people don’t think he has anything worth saying. The TRUTH is that they will continue down the same path of engaging in self destructive behavior and living in poverty and Mr. Cosby will still be rich!

        6. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          Addressing one statement while ignoring the others is taking the entire statement of context. You said you wanted to know why some people make it out of the hood, so I shared with you that I made it out but had a different take than so many blacks who make it out. That was my point–nothing more. This part of the distraction is over. Lets get back to the real issue–looking at the structural issues versus individual responsibility.

        7. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell chamberslee 
          Cosby had the most luck of anyone. I wish he would acknowledge that fact. He would not be Dr. cosby without the luck and help of the system he received along the way. Cosby did not make it because of hard work but because of A LOT OF LUCK. So he comes across as a hypocrite in some regards. Yes, he has his money and that is the problem. Too many black people share the same sentiment: I have my money and forget everyone else. 
          He did not work hard to get the education he so proudly displays. No, he had a great deal of luck.

        8. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell chamberslee 
          Cosby was a class clown who did not apply himself. He dropped out of school after repeating the 10th grade three (3) times. He earned his GED through correspondence courses while in the Navy. He enrolled in Temple University where he dropped out to pursue a career in show business (Dyson, 2005). He NEVER finished his bachelor’s degree: It was bestowed upon him because of what the school deemed “life experience” (Dyson, 2005, p. 60). Cosby enrolled in a part time doctoral program where he was awarded the Ed.D in 1977–but there was controversy surrounding that degree, also.  Reginald Damerell, a professor who sat on Cosby’s dissertation committee said Cosby hardly took a course and received course credit for appearing on Sesame Street and The Electric Company and his dissertation analyzed the impact of his show (Dyson, 2005, p.61).  
          My point, Cosby had a great deal of help and luck.  Today, we would frown on someone with that many questions marks or asterisks next to his education. His fame helped him avoid having to earn a bachelor’s degree, attend all doctoral courses or write a dissertation that significantly contributes to the field of education.  
          Cosby was no different than many of the athletics and poor students he criticizes for not focusing on education: He placed more focus on perfecting his comedy than studying and focusing on education. 
          He had a great deal of help and luck in succeeding in education, but seems to have forgotten that fact. He did not take individual responsibility as much as he would have you think he did. 
          Like Cosby, many poor black people need some assistance and luck and they can do well also. 
          PS: When Cosby attended college it was affordable. A teacher told me she was able to pay for an apartment, a car and school for the entire year on a $6000 grant. Politicians on both sides are now trying to raise tuition costs and make it even more difficult for poor blacks to attended college or avoid massive debt. 
          Again, policy reform is needed and individual responsibility will have no impact because tuition increase is a policy issue. 
          References 
          Dyson, M.E. (2005). Is Bill Cosby right?: Or has the black middle class lost its mid? New York, New York:  Basic Civitas Books.

        9. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell You can tell by the lack of depth and understanding that Cosby is not an intellectual. They worship Cosby because he has money, not for his intelligence. This goes back to the point that some of  believe that Money is God. They are no different than slaveholders willing to massacre Indians and enslave blacks for the almighty dollar. When I was growing up the Pimps and Drug Dealers always had money because they were willing to sell their souls for a dollar. Yet, they had no longevity and were not respected by any self-respecting person in the community. I admire the people who come back to the community (or remain in it), and share their time and expertise. There are hardworking educated people and some who are not educated and work hard. The goal is not to see who can own a Mercedes or wear Prada, it is to have a fulfilling life. Have someone say, “Something you said or did made a difference in my life.”  I am not saying the Cos has not made a difference in peoples lives but he should stick to entertainment and stop pointing the finger. Where is the blame against the White Man who killed his son? He has no angry words for White Folks who demand their right to carry guns. He should be on the Front lines making those demands. Come to think of it I have never seen him on any front line.

        10. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee Basically you are saying that Bill Cosby has no right to lecture anyone about getting an education because he has had his own trouble with education? He has no right to criticize anyone for not getting an education right? There are people who are not listening to ANYBODY in regards to education. They aren’t listening to Dyson, Obama, Oprah, or any other formally educated person. Perhaps some blacks do seem to get “lucky”. Perhaps too many are waiting to get lucky. I guess that’s true because man blacks also play the lottery as their get rich plan. Another problem in the black community is the priorities. Many blacks won’t go into debt for an education but don’t seem to mind getting into debt for an expensive car or a plasma tv or new clothes. Actually poor black students who maintain good grades are actually eligible for more grants and scholarships than middle class students with the same grades. Unfortunately our children are led to believe that they can only get into college by playing sports. Most HBCUs have tuition that is lower or comparable to in-state tuition at public university. And usually the mean acceptable SAT scores are lower than many predominately white universities, which somewhat even lowers the bar for the academic standard, not necessarily saying it’s a good thing, but it may be a favorable thing when it comes to providing an opportunity for our children to attend college. Some state universities had a tuition freeze during the last few years to keep tuition rates lower. However, many private universities continued to raise their tuition including HBCUs. Of course some of these universities do not receive a lion’s share of government funding. But that goes back to government interest. In addition to racism, there are economic factors to why there is little/no interest in investing in these schools. I am not making excuses for the race based policies in this country. However, blacks have to stop making excuses for why we don’t take advantage of the opportunities that we do have.

        11. JustOneWoman says:

          chamberslee KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell    I’ve never heard (nor read) Bill Cosby say ‘do as I did.’ If the advice that he’s giving is good advice – is it good advice only if it lies within certain parameters?  If he had said ‘be the class clown’ etc etc – would that validate him as a good uh advice giver?  Maybe he’s saying don’t put your faith in ‘luck.’

        12. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee
          Read Dyson’s book. If you still feel individual responsibility trumps policy reform, read anything Dr. King wrote and remember that Dr. King understood that policy reform was the key to improving opportunities and the overall well being of black communities. Everything Dr. King did was to change policy and gain civil rights for oppressed people–that included white people, as well. Although Dr. King reminded black people to carry themselves with the utmost dignity and respect (individual responsibility), that was part of the movement to change oppressive policies. If that does not change your mind, you have drank the koolaid somewhere. All I can say is good luck.

        13. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee I have actually read a couple of Dyson’s books as well as the works of Dr. King. However you are missing the point. Your entire agenda is to focus on public policy and what you expect the government to do for poor people with little attention to personal accountability. You keep saying that personal accountability has a minimal affect on changing the socioeconomic status of the black community, yet you sidestepped the issue of how you managed your own progress in spite of bad public policy. This is the piece that you seem to not want to discuss. If I were to accept your position, I would have to believe that if a million black people did some of the same things you did, whatever those things were, that they would not be successful anyway because they would just not be “lucky”. So they need public policy to change their luck I suppose. So we have a formula of public policy and luck. (Yeah, that’s very motivational and good advice too). It seems that you are the one who has been sipping the kool-aid my friend and you obviously don’t really know a thing about the black community. It seems that everything you THINK you know, you read it in a book!

        14. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          I am not asking if you have read anything by Dyson; I am asking you to read “Is Bill Cosby Right?: Or Has the Black Middle Class Lost its Mind?” because there are facts and insights you need to ingest. 
          Individual responsibility should include black people learning how the political system works and what political leaders’ jobs are. Demanding local, state and federal government fund education fairly, for example, is the job of the people who are affected by unfair, oppressive policies. Politicians work for us–we pay their salaries. I am not asking for welfare checks. To paraphrase Dr. King, open the door and we will walk through it.  In other words, we are not asking for a handout but an opportunity for a level playing field where poor black urban students can compete–fairly–with middle class white and black students. 
          Policy reform is needed to prevent the underfunding and unnecessary closure of urban schools, for example. You never explain how individual responsibility–Rush Limbaugh’s talking points–will stop underfunding and closure of  schools in poor urban communities. 
          I do not have an agenda. I said individual responsibility has a place but it is not and should not be the focal point because it does not have any influence on public policy. You sound like the Tea Partiers who say they want government out of their business but do not want government to end their social security or medicare: They do not understand that those are government programs. They do not understand how government works. 
          The Sandy Hook parents are in Washington weekly, it seems, demanding gun safety laws. Based on your premise, they are wrongly depending on government to fix their problem–they should take responsibility to fix it themselves. Guess what, they are taking responsibility: They have organized a coalition of community members and politicians along with the president and they are making their voices and concerns heard at the local, state and federal level. They are on news programs, often. They understand how politics work. 
          They are not putting the blame on personal responsibility; they are putting the blame on the proliferation of guns–a structural problem that requires policy reform.
          Again, both individual responsibility and policy reform are being addressed by the Sandy Hook parents. That is what I argue for in the black community: both approaches are needed to bring about success–BOTH. 
          Now I know I am not going to change your mind and that is OK. This individual responsibility thing has been embedded in you and there is no changing it. Facts be damned.

        15. whitebl09 says:

          chamberslee again  KhrystleNichole is right. Dr. King was talking about policy change.. 50 years ago when he was marching for common rights that all men should have. Of course there is a need for policy change when you are going to segregated schools, restaurants, bathrooms, etc. We’re not blind to the fact that there are still many issues that need to be fixed but there is more opportunity now for a young, Black man in this country than there has ever been. They are giving black kids college educations if we can just get them out of high school with decent grades. It might take some time to research these things to find out but there is plenty of opportunity out there going to waste

        16. chamberslee says:

          whitebl09 chamberslee KhrystleNichole 
          Both you and she are wrong. It does not matter how long ago Dr. King fought for policy reform. Policy reform is always needed when there are unfair, unbalanced, oppressive polices that prevent one group from having equal opportunities compared to other groups. I only used Dr. King as an example that even he believed, as I do, that policy reform is necessary to bring about the greatest and farthest reaching change, not individual responsibility–although individual responsibility plays a part.  It is not the reason for many of the problems in the black community, unless you believe the media depiction  and Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Glenn Beck, George Will and other people of their ilk. 
          Sure there are many opportunities for blacks, but that is not my focus. My focus is on looking at real problems and finding real solutions to help poor black people achieve more and that requires a macro approach–policy reform.  For example, according to Dyson, some suburban schools provided as much as $15,000 per student whereas some urban schools provide as little as $1,500 per student. That disparity prevents urban students, mostly blacks, from being able to complete on the same level with better funded schools. I read about a white student who created a video game for his senior project. It was so impressive, he was offered a $75,000 job straight out of high school. There is a another student who created technology that can charge a cell phone in 20 seconds. She is going to Harvard at 16. Urban students do not have these opportunities due to the lack of funding. According to Dyson, one Urban school was using books so old it gave the impression Nixon was still in office. Now many urban schools are closing–but there is money to build a $400 million prison. We need policy reform.
          Education is experienced differently among blacks from lower and upper economic status, as well, which makes it difficult for  many black people to grasp the problem. That is another discussion, though.

        17. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee You don’t read very well. If you have been reading my comments, you would see that I am not disputing the fact that there are certain government policies that need reforming. It seems that you are on the soapbox that government policy is a greater need than individual responsibility. I’m going to talk about your example of Sandy Hook. As you stated the people in the community have gone to the government with their complaints and demands. The people in the black community often don’t do this. When something happens, they instead they wait for Al Sharpton to show up. If you are shooting and killing people in your own community every day, why would you expect “others” to care about guns in your neighborhood? If you don’t care, others will not care. And I hate to tell you, but in many of these neighborhoods, “the vast majority” are not just hard working poor people trying to get by. Some are but not the vast majority. When was the last time you have been to “da hood”? I don’t think you have been in a long time or if ever at all. This is not 1973 and “da hood” has changed. Right now you’re preaching to the choir. It’s not me who you need to explain how politics work to. It’s the poor blacks that are being left behind in these deteriorating neighborhoods that you say you’re so concerned about who need to understand how politics work. Maybe if they understood, they would take more personal responsibility. Everything is a continuum. Everything is 360. Hotep!

        18. chamberslee says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          When you start with insults, I do not take you seriously and stop at the first sentence. Have a good day.

        19. ajamu chaminuka says:

          chamberslee whitebl09 KhrystleNichole I would just add that today we need more than Policy reform. The u.s. system is so corrupted by big money that we are now experiencing the beginning of fascism with Obomber being used as the tool of mass deception to introduce the police state. When even Ralph Nader defines the situation as such, it’s worth thinking about. I predict more and more police repression which will indicate that it’s late in the day for Policy reform. We need to overthrow the entire system of racism/white supremacy if we as a people are to survive.

        20. KhrystleNichole says:

          chamberslee Insults? I’m sorry you feel insulted. However, if you read back a little, you actually said some things to me that I could take as an insult. For one, you implied that I have no knowledge of politics and how they work. But I’m a big girl, and eh….I know who I am. But I did not deliberately insult you, nor would I deliberately insult you or anyone on this post. There would be no reason for me to. I’m just making a few points and I’m sorry you’re upset because I don’t agree with you. Peace.

        21. bwdn2008 says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee You are comparing a Middle Class Predominantly White Community to an under served Community which is predominantly minority. Why don’t you compare the community to a white community in the Ozarks, which is devastated by Methamphetamine?  Maybe you don’t make that comparison because the media downplays communities of poor whites. So instead you use the analogy you are most familiar and comfortable with. Do you ever ask yourself where all of the guns are coming from? I don’t know any African Americans who own a Gun Manufacturing Factory. When you go to a Gun Show, the sellers are white males, and the shows are run by the Gun Lobby. The drugs are not manufactured in our community so where do they come from? What bank launders the money? Who benefits from the sales of Guns and drugs in our community. Like you, those caught in the middle of this madness do not ask those questions. They are too busy trying to survive and I understand why they don’t ask those questions. What is your reason for not asking those questions?

        22. ajamu chaminuka says:

          whitebl09 chamberslee KhrystleNichole Yes, they may be ‘giving some Black kids college educations’ as you put it but ‘they’ are also killing Black kids. You talk like Black people are living in america the beautiful. And furthermore, if ‘they’ are ‘giving’ Black kids college educations to become house educated negroes like Obomber, how is that helping Black people?

        23. ajamu chaminuka says:

          KhrystleNichole chamberslee Dear sister, do you really believe that the vast majority of people in any Black community are not hard working people trying to get by? Wow! You have an image of Black people that sounds like something you heard on right wing radio. Yes, too many of our people are messed up but that is due to living under racism/white supremacy. Yes, it’s on us to get out from under but don’t make light of the social conditions created by the white man as Bill Cosby seems to do.

        24. KhrystleNichole says:

          ajamu chaminuka chamberslee I didn’t hear this on the radio. I’ve actually seen it. Please don’t twist my words for the sake of a point. I never said black people in “any” black community are not hard working and trying to get by. There are some low income black communities where people do work and care about their community. I stated that earlier. However, there are far too many of our communities that fall into ruin, partially because we do not care enough. I am not making light of our social conditions. But I really do tire of the excuse that much of our destructive behavior is because we are poor. Actually, the reason that I do not subscribe to this theory is because I do know that there are quite a number of black people who have been able to make a positive difference in their lives and the lives of others in spite of having grown up poor. Most of this is due to certain choices they made which had very little if any to do with favorable public policies for them. I’m not sure why some of you are insisting that those of us who are advocating personal responsibility are downplaying or disregarding the need for the eradication of racist government policies. I don’t think we are the ones who aren’t getting that point. However, it does seem that many of you rather downplay or disregard how personal life choices can make the black plight even harder.

        25. KhrystleNichole says:

          ajamu chaminuka whitebl09 chamberslee There is always something to learn in every situation. Sometimes to beat the enemy at his game, you have to learn to play his game. You have to know what he knows.You have to think like he thinks. The key is to expand upon what you learn from him. And then you use that knowledge to defeat him. We have to stop teaching our kids that getting an education is about going to ask the white guy for a job. We have to teach our children to become the creators and masters of their own destiny. It’s not about becoming an educated house negro.

        26. ajamu chaminuka says:

          KhrystleNichole ajamu chaminuka chamberslee No one can disagree about the need for personal responsibility. What i’m saying is that personal responsibility as important as it is, does not negate the need to struggle against an all encompassing system of racism/white supremacy that holds down a whole people. The people in the Nation of Islam take personal responsibility and are still as oppressed as the rest of us. I believe that many people would prefer to focus more on blaming ourselves than blaming the system because then we would have to look at the issue of revolution because reform ain’t gon’ do nothin’ for us as many are starting to realize. The need to destroy this oppressive system is obvious but scary because we still fear the slavemaster. We would rather have our young warriors shooting at each other than shooting at the real cause of their problem. We would rather not look at the responsibility of Mr Bobo because we as a whole have yet to BREAK THE FEAR BARRIER which we will have to do to confront the fundamental cause of our disfunction. Bill Cosby and others like him fear white supremacy’s awesome capacity for violence and therefore are more like to  aim their fire at the street rather than the suite.

        27. CarolParks says:

          It is clear, that Mr. Cosby is an intellectual. He speaks with common sense, with clarity, and with thoughtfulness. He supports the AA community, thru charities, and scholarships. He speaks from the heart, with no malice intended, but instead a real concern for anyone not choosing the right path. He is no different then in any culture of people preaching to be better, and to enhance your life, so you can succeed, and your community benefits from it.
          In reality, this subject can be discussed day & night forever. But, instead of just talking real solutions need to be addressed.
          Each community needs a leader, whether thru the church, or someone political living in that community. Bi- weekly meetings should be a goal to have as many in that community as possible to attend. Then the main subjects should be what are the main concerns in that particular community that needs to be addressed? And how to solve those concerns.
          Taking the Power back, should be a priority. Having legal representation available in each community for people who are harassed, illegal arrest’s, gang problems, innocent people stopped by the police for nothing, etc. paying for this legal representation would be a determined amount from each individual every month from everyone, just like people who give to the church. Everyone in that community would have access to that Attorney. That is real power, fight the system on their own terms until it changes. The political leaders, along with the police would have no choice but to listen to you, as you are now a powerful group with legal representation. Getting the local news informed of everything going on, your concerns, your demands.
          Eventually, each leader in each community, could get together and then your own power would be overwhelming. It doesn’t have to be all AA either, as so many communities are mixed. But, having everyone in each community supporting one another is the objective. Having everyone support the local or new AA business. Having solutions to problems such as playgrounds that are not safe, schools that not only need to stay open, but need improvements.
          It won’t happen all at once, but it is very doable. Instead of us against them attitude, it should be all of us working together in each community to have equal ness and fairness for all. Stop the police brutality, the illegal arrests, the constant ignoring of your issues, because these crooked politicians are ignoring you. They won’t, & can’t if you are organized, and demand changes. Your votes do count, and can take out the criminal politicians who are ruining your lives. And you can do it without having to break one law.
          Make them listen to you. Take your power back. You do have it, they just don’t want you to know how to take it back. Our President, once was a community worker, in a very poor neighborhood. He brought in programs to feed the children there, and medical care. Despite all the racism that does still exist, in 2008, 68% of white women, and 52% of white men voted for this President. The numbers were lower in 2012, because of the economy and jobs. But, that was a majority of whites voting for him. So we are on the right path.
          It is our own government that is in essence against the poor, and the middle class. It will be about money in the future only, the haves, and the have nots. We all need to support one another and make sure this country is better, equal, and has opportunities for all of our children, not just some. But, we need more then talking on here, we need Action.

        28. CarolParks says:

          Mr. Cosby had success despite of that. Not because of luck, but because of his intelligence. His real life experience taught him a lot. Many have degrees, and still fail. One of the most intelligent people I ever knew, had only a second grade education. She was AA, well spoken, with great common sense. She was self taught, and everyone that met her was very impressed. Including people with PHD’S. intelligence is not about how many degrees you have, but what you do with your life. Mr. Cosby has a lot of knowledge to share.

        29. CarolParks says:

          Take your power back. Read my comment below please. It is more then possible to have your voice heard, your demands met, but first each community must organize, and have an honest leader. And Legal representation. It is possible.

        30. whitebl09 says:

          ajamu chaminuka whitebl09 chamberslee KhrystleNichole I personally think that Obama’s election could have been a great thing for Blacks if there weren’t so many people looking for him to personally move mountains for them.

        31. bwdn2008 says:

          ajamu chaminuka KhrystleNichole chamberslee So True! Some Black Folks fear whites more than God and define success not in spiritual terms or freedom, but in material terms. So those with the most money speak the loudest whether or not they are moral people. That is the crooked system set up by Europeans, who only acknowledge and reward blacks who love them more then their own people. Which is why blacks get in good positions and often times do not bring in other blacks.  The master trusts his Negro to weed out the trouble makers (as in Django).

        32. KhrystleNichole says:

          I think we can debate this issue all day every day. I honestly think many of us are saying the same things but in a different way. Some of us are speaking more from a political standpoint while others are speaking from a more social point if view. I don’t think neither side is necessarily wrong in their viewpoints. Therefore Bill Cosby is not wrong. Perhaps he isn’t saying all you would like to hear but that doesn’t mean that what he did say was wrong. An incomplete answer does not mean it’s an entirely wrong answer. If that were the case then many of you would be wrong too since many of you don’t discuss in great detail how personal responsibility and public policy changes or takeovers would work in sync to better the condition of blacks in this country. The fact is that they both have to happen. Therefore both matters need to be addressed. “Life begins at the end of your comfort zone.”~~Neale Donald Walsch

        33. whitebl09 says:

          ajamu chaminuka I don’t even get what you are getting at with the house educated negroes comment. Honestly, alot of people really need to read up on what Obama has done and the things he has actually tried to do and you may have a different perspective. You don’t grade on potential, I understand that and I wish he had done better but considering what he was handed I personally have no gripes with where the country is at this point. But enough about Obama. I don’t know what “they” you are referring to. Black and White institutions offer minority scholarships that Blacks can take advantage of. There are many service and professional organizations that provide scholarships for Blacks and also help them find employment. The National Society of Black Engineeers (NSBE) for instance, is probably responsible for getting hundreds or thousands of engineers hired on a yearly basis at their conferences. But it’s all about knowing.. and once you know putting in the effort… and once you get yours.. reaching back to let others know what’s out there. I didn’t know about NSBE growing up but because I didn’t have engineers in my family and didn’t know any personally. I went to an HBCU it was a big thing there. Now that I am out of school and I personally work with the youth I let them know about these things and try to help them on that path.

        34. KhrystleNichole says:

          whitebl09 ajamu chaminuka If a child told you that he/she was admitted to any institution of higher education, even if it was a predominately white university, that you, ajamu chaminuka, would not say to that child that he/she would become an educated house negro. These are the discouraging remarks that are often made to our youth that keeps them from excelling. Too many smart black kids in low income communities try to dumb it down so they won’t appear to be nerds, geeks or sell-outs. It’s hard for children when they live in a community that only has respect for swag. You are judged by well you dress and how well you dance as opposed to how well you speak and how well you read. We have to get away from this mindset. When you make education synonymous with a negative image such as a “house negro”, you plant the seeds subconsciously that higher learning is not for black people. This is especially important for our black boys. They need all the positive reinforcement we can give them. As I said before, we really have to also get away from thinking that the entire purpose for a formal education is to go to work for the white guy.

        35. CarolParks says:

          KhrystleNichole. Brilliant insight. Nothing is more important, then to have a child get as much education as possible. A high school education is not enough anymore. Education, and a strong belief in yourself, and what you can accomplish, is the door that opens you to limitless possibilities. Teachers, parents, everyone has a duty to encourage children to reach for the stars, because those stars are within their grasp. Never put anyone in a box, that says no you can’t. Remember this President said yes we can, and he did against the biggest odds. Our children are our future.

        36. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks Whether or not Bill Cosby is an intellectual is not relevant in this discussion. The fact that Barack Obomber received a majority of white and Black votes just shows his success at deception especially of Black voters for whom he has done essentially nothing in almost five years as president The situation of the Black cpmmunity is worse now than when he first came into office. As you yourself stated, the government is “in essence against the poor and the middle class”. That means that the people’s votes do not really count and that the government is controlled by people other than those who voted for it. So the solution must then be a complete change in the system of governance so that it’s the will of the people that the government responds to not the will of the big money boys aka the ruling class, the capitalists, the illuminati or whatever label you want to use. That change will have to come as your Thomas Jefferson said, through revolution. This government is beyond reform and getting worse with the patriot act, the ndaa, cispa, and all the other laws passed by congress and signed by Obomber to usher in a fascist state. Until we change completely the conditions in this country, all the personal responsibility in the world will not make life better. The people need the complete overthrow of this racist, capitalist, and imperialist police state!

        37. ajamu chaminuka says:

          whitebl09 ajamu chaminuka The educational system in this country is a misnomer, we should call it the mis-education system as it regards African people in the u.s. That is why so many Black people even those with higher degrees sell out to the system such as Obomber and most of the congressional Black caucus and so many others. Dr John Henrik Clarke taught that Black people need to jettison every thing they learned under the white racist controlled mis-education system and start to re-learn starting with that which will educate us about ourselves and our history. Without that, we wind up with all this knowledge that we put to use to advance white supremacy instead of advancing our own people. The best example is Barack Obomber and the Black mis-leadership class in high position today. The National Society of Black Engineers and other organizations are trying to do a good job but in the context of this system of racism/white supremacy, who do the Black engineers advance, Who do they work for?  Who employs them and for what?  Check out Carter G. Woodson’s mis-education of the negro to begin to understand why so many of us in the Black community are in the situation we’re in. Yes, we have to take personal responsibility, but we must first take personal responsibility to organize ourselves to overthrow this modified slave system that keeps us ignorant, mis-educated and oppressed.

        38. ajamu chaminuka says:

          KhrystleNichole whitebl09 ajamu chaminuka NO, i was educated in catholic schools by the sisters of St Joseph and by the Jesuits in elite schools and i respect those white people who gave me a good basis to be able to reeducate myself into knowledge of self and history. But that’s the key, i stress to all children the value of education but unlike you i caution the Black youth about the white supremacist influence in this country’s educational program. I say to them, learn about your history so that when you do get your degree in whatever field, you will know how best to put it to use for yourself and your people.

        39. KhrystleNichole says:

          ajamu chaminuka You have not said anything different than what I have said. I repeatedly stated that learning goes beyond what children are taught in the classroom. It is an incomplete education at best. The point I was making is that if you discourage children from learning what they can learn in a traditional school setting, you will do impede their learning process altogether. Just as you said, it is a basis.  Do you realize how many black children and their parents for that matter have no idea who Dr. John Henrik Clarke is? Of course you may not hear of him in your average public or private school classroom, but that’s when you have to seek knowledge beyond the classroom. Many have never read the Mis-Education of the the Negro. They may have never heard of the book. History is one of the most biased and incomplete courses taught in school. However, just because the history lessons are inaccurate, does that mean you shouldn’t go to math class or English class? The idea is that we have to keep children open to learning. Too many of our youth and adults have given up on learning.

        40. ajamu chaminuka says:

          KhrystleNichole ajamu chaminuka We agree! Please follow me on fb, i welcome critique!

        41. fairydust says:

          Yvette Carnell KhrystleNichole chamberslee 
          You have posited your version of the truth so whats wrong with Cosby and others positing theirs?

        42. fairydust says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee KhrystleNichole Yvette Carnell 
          Its very judgmental for you to say people like Cosby for his money and not his intellect.  I find him to be intellectual and while I investigate the claims made by the prior poster, have you listened to any of his commencement speeches made at HBCU’s?  They were not shallow or lacking in substance.

        43. fairydust says:

          chamberslee KhrystleNichole 
          Professor Dyson is hardly a credible source to rely on.  I have both read his book and seen him in person and came away feeling gravely disappointed.

    5. ajamu chaminuka says:

      Honey Hayes I agree with the thrust of your letter but i have to say you seem to make light of the responsability of the system of racism/white supremacy which is the fundamental cause for our situation in north america. Yes, even during slavery some people  succeeded though mostly by escaping. We as a people will not rise until we are willing to stand up and FIGHT to destroy that which holds us down physically and mentally.

    6. fairydust says:

      Honey Hayes You are spot on!  I found nothing wrong with Bill Cosbey’s comments.  As a former educator I am witness to the lack of parental  involvement in poor neighborhoods.  We cannot blame everything on the government.  We have to take responsibility for ourselves.  Most of us have to get re-educated in careers that are in demand.  While there are many children of color who excel in school, unfortunately tend to be the exception and not the rule. I also have heard people rave about living in the projects and wish to stay there, some even leave their apartment to their children as if it’s some entitlement.  Brother Cosby said nothing wrong.

      1. bwdn2008 says:

        fairydust Honey Hayes So you have not taught in any Suburban Schools only in poor black neighborhoods? My brother is a retired Professor from The University of Massachusetts at Boston and also taught poor blacks in schools in California. He said the most entitled, lazy people he ever worked with were Middle Class White Males. They did not appreciate him giving them anything below a B, even though they were not willing to put in the work. He stated that these, “Entitled” Whites should spend time Volunteering in Poor Neighborhoods (like the Kennedy’s). My brother has degrees from Stanford and Harvard and was a English Professor. He is one of the most brilliant persons I know and an Intellectual. There are many like him who get there education and contribute without ever being acknowledge. After retiring he served on the School Board in Beaufort SC and wrote a report on the failure of the System to educate black males. His conclusions come from a variety of experiences as we were raised in a poor working class neighborhood. We attended school with students who may have been poor but were extremely intelligent. These students went on to Colleges, Universities, and some went into the Military. The ones who fared the worst were those who went into the Military and came back as Drug Addicts suffering from PTSD. Maybe you are seeing their children in your classrooms. What I find sad is people who are educated and do not understand or empathize with those they interact with.

      2. KhrystleNichole says:

        fairydust Honey Hayes Many brown people are missing the point. No one is saying that ALL poor people are lazy and apathetic. However, many of us know that far too many of us are. Again, if these were really only isolated incidents, then this entire topic would be a non-issue.

        1. JamesHarvin says:

          KhrystleNichole fairydust Honey Hayes   you are so right.  Every time someone makes a comment about black people that doesn’t attribute all of our troubles on white people, some African-Americans yell “condescending,” and try to label good advice as blame.  SOME  of us have done things that are self-destructive and self-defeating.  I believe that those who refuse to acknowledge this simple truth are even more dangerous to us than the oppressive society and policies with which we live.

      3. ajamu chaminuka says:

        fairydust Honey Hayes Fairydust, Of course you see nothing wrong with Bill Cosby’s comments because you are a former educator who was mis-educated and passed on that mis-education to your students. How do i know? By your own words! No one questions the accuracy of many of Cosby’s comments. It’s how and where he does it and the fact that he ignores the role of racism/white supremacy in the condition of Black people not only in material terms but as well in psychological ways. He never has any criticisms to make of the Black mis-leadership class of mis-educated negroes who connive with our historical oppressors for positions of power and corruption while doing nothing substantial for the Black masses. As a former mis-educator you should be trying to re-educate yourself  to make up for the years you spent misleading our children into thinking that all they had to do was excel in school anf find careers that are in demand. Start with Carter G. Woodson’s MIS-EDUCATION OF THE NEGRO? You need it!

  59. arnettra says:

    I pretty much agree with mr. cosby.

  60. ajamu chaminuka says:

    Carol, Barack Obomber has done so many great things for the African community in the country that we are worse off now than when he was first elected. And i make no distinction between democrats and republicans who are two sides of the same racist, imperialist, and war-mongering system.

    1. CarolParks says:

      ajamu chaminuka Again, you have ignored my reply to you about President Obama. I believe that President Obama has done the best he can, considering he has a Congress that refuses to work with him, and even Democrat’s that will not stand up for him either.
      As far as corruption, yes both the GOP, and the DEM’S  have corruption, more so the GOP. I also wrote on here, how to take your power back from the corruption that exists. Too bad you have not read any of my reply’s. Oh, well. Have a good day.

      1. ajamu chaminuka says:

        CarolParks ajamu chaminuka Dear Carol, i have read and understood all of your posts. We differ on Obomber. You have yet to understand and see that Obomber is a deceiver who has sweet talked his way to power through lies and conniving with the powers that be who financed his rise even when he was a state senator. Thats was when he was spotted and recruited by the big money boys who are adept at seeking out and choosing those they feel will serve their purpose in exchange for fame and riches. As far as taking back power, history is best qualified to reward all research, to paraphrase Malcolm X. Those who hold power never let it go without a fight. Just look around at the world today, the people have to muscle their way back to power and it’s not easy, it’s usually bloody. I wish you a good day also!

        1. CarolParks says:

          Hi, ajamu chaminuka! Thanks for your reply. Well, you know you have your opinion of President Obama, & I have mine. We will just leave it at that, people cannot always agree. It has been an interesting conversation, & I believe we all learn something when we debate subject’s. enjoy your evening! Peace! 🙂

    2. greeneink says:

      ajamu chaminuka Obomber: Typical “whitespeak” for a creepy crawly cockroach going on black forums pretending to be black.

  61. roylee47 says:

    Is the truth we are looking for to sum up why some people succeed, and some people fail as simplistic as 2+2= 4? 
    When we ascertain that those of our fellow African Americans who haven’t achieved the same amount of success as those of us who have achieved success they must be the sole responsible individuals for their problems?
     How can we in one phrase claim the victory for making it against the odds( yes the odds) and then criticize those who fell on the other side of the equation as though they didn’t have any odds to face?Or, they were given a fair opportunity to begin with.
      Have we forgotten the purpose of the sifter? Or since we did not fall victim to the sifter we should now turn on those who did.
     The fact is that there are those who made it whose circumstances were anything but ideal. There possibilities of failure were so close to 100%  that even with a measurement taken 100% was all that could be determined. Yet, they made it.
    On the other end of the spectrum there were those who had everything going for them. They were already given a key to the door before the door was even constructed. Yet , they failed.And then there are those (the majority who lie in between these two examples and you can bet there are a larger amount of failures then there are successes.
     When the deck is stacked the players should join forces to address the dealer to demand that all those playing get to experience victories. Yes, plural on the victories. But , that’s not what happens. The winners scream and shout over their many victories, and look at the losers as to say” you better act like you want to win”! As though they traveled from where ever their homes were with a purposeful intent on losing.  Really?
     I guess that’s what the winners will say when they need a reason to justify why they should keep on winning ,and have no guilt or be in any way convicted to the point when they will advocate for the loser instead of blaming them for their demise.
     Aren’t we so much like this in our communities. Oh we may develop complex screens to thwart others from seeing where we are coming from, and in the same motion hold them accountable for their failures by asking them “If i could make it why couldn’t you”?
    This systematically “washes our hands ” so we can go on labeling them as losers, and lazy people when in fact with the deck stacked we didn’t need a tarot card reader to figure this one out.
    When we sit back with the belief that the “dealer” gave everyone the same odds on winning who is really being unrealistic and living in a fantasy world? The successful ones are obligated to question the dealer to ask why aren’t the losers winning at all because we know that if the deck is not stacked that no one will walk  away without at least one win.
    Then again when we are winning we do have the” CHOICE”  to choose to care, or not to care! What a luxury!

    1. bwdn2008 says:

      roylee47 I agree. I often hear Mr. Cosby say how blessed he is. Does that mean that the people who do not have his success are cursed? It is not his success but his attitude that folks will remember. No one is addressing that fact that his son was killed by a white man, but Cosby only criticizes the African American Community.

      1. JamesHarvin says:

        bwdn2008 roylee47   It is not true that Dr. Cosby only criticizes the black community.  First, he always talks about the society in which we live and it racist nature.  Second, he only talks about certain self-defeating and self-destructive things that SOME  African-Americans do.  When you have a chance to read or hear his remarks in their entirety, not just the bits and pieces that alarmists want to use, you will see the truth.

        1. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          JamesHarvin bwdn2008 roylee47 So true. Like the old folks say, “A hit dog will bark.”

      2. roylee47 says:

        bwdn2008 roylee47 

        bwdn2008, forgive me the length of this reply. I don’t intend to make you feel that my way of thinking is the only way to come around too. I just added some things here that I feel are missing in our community today. We all hold the key to our communities revival. Not one part of us is insignificant. If any fraction is missing; then we can’t be whole! 
        If we are here today then we are Blessed.No one persons success, or failure can alter that. I admire the passion that burns within your writings. God Bless You! 
        I’d like to tell you that I could interpret the the exact meaning of what he said in reference to his being Blessed. I don’t believe that in saying so that he meant that all who have fallen short are cursed. 
        Many times it is not a curse that people don’t reach the same level of success that others are enjoying. In most instances it is God who has us in a hovering pattern until it is the right time for us to obtain what he has for us. No one person, organization local, national, or global can keep us from receiving what God has for us. But, while we are hovering we need to be busy towards self-improvement to be prepared for that Blessing.
         I grew up with Bill Cosby. As I watched him on television I was oblivious at that time to what hurdles that he must have had to face. But, the quality of his programming was always positive, and on point. As an African American you could hold your head up with pride. If you think that programming for us is hard to find on the networks here in the present day it was even more scarce back then. Quality programming was even much much scarce(it was basically non-existent). 
        It wasn’t the plan of the networks to give us quality programming, yet he didn’t conform to what the network were willing to welcome with open arms. But, that didn’t stop him from giving it to us. Not because he was so Blessed while we were so cursed. But he has always taken the Blessings he has received , and passed them down to us so we would feel proud to be Black people.He fought for us to have this Blessing.
        But he is not perfect. And, he will be the first to tell you that. In this day , and time when the cry for more “Black men” goes out everyday; here he is. A black man that is respectable in our community, and throughout the world. He could actually turn his back to the problems we face, and not risk going bankrupt , or losing his assets. I am saying this because as many see it , especially the author of this post that he is sounding “condescending”. Black men when I grew up were not about the gab, but about action. They used few words to convey what they required, but as children you didn’t want them to say too much because when they had to talk a lot you knew that a butt whippin’ was close behind(no pun intended LOL).
        Back then most butt whippings were given because after they told you more than twice you needed some reinforcement. And believe it or not it wasn’t abuse. It was the proper medicine for that inability to ingest the verbal instruction. You didn’t have to be told again. The value of a black man in stock terms: he was considered to be a “blue chip stock”. Was every black man  deserving of that title? Of course not! 
        Every black father wasn’t running out on their families either. As quiet as it was kept; many white men abandoned their families, and many white females were welfare recipients. But the media has never used an unbiased paint brush when they have portrayed our community situations, and that of our counter parts community issues. So just like crime only flourished in our neighborhoods so did the stories of only our black men were deserting their wives, and children. Or, high volumes of crime only being in black neighborhoods
        So I don’t see Dr, Cosby as being condescending, but more as that “Black Man” from my era who is simultaneously asking us to look at what we are doing that is out -of -line, and because he sees us faltering he realizes that saying it in a motherly tone is just not appropriate. It’s just not in the DNA of a strong black man! 
        Regretfully, the strong black man is not in the forefront, and anymore in no longer considered to be the norm. Voices like  Rev.Dr.Martin Luther King; we have forgotten what that voice sounds like. That is why when Rev Al Sharpton advocates many of our own think he is too brash. It’s the sound of the authoritative black man. who knows who he is, and isn’t going to apologize for it.
          Those black men who have fought the fight, and continue to fight the fight have earned the right to sound authoritative(not condescending). We need to hear it more often so that many of these problems we face in our communities can be seriously addressed, and dealt with ASAP.

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          roylee47 bwdn2008 I understand what you are conveying and also see Bill Cosby in that light. I was raised not 30 miles from Philadelphia in Chester County Pennsylvania. We were surrounded by whites and our community was segregated, not by law but if you stepped out of your, “Place” the ramifications were swift. My father and mother, grandparents, cousins, Aunts and Uncles made up my community for twelve years of my life. In my predominantly black community almost every man worked in the Mill. There were black businesses dependent on the Mill to survive and they prospered. My father was the first black constable where we lived and worked two jobs most of my life. There were poor blacks in the community but we did not allow anyone to go hungry. There were people with Alcohol addictions and were were taught not to point the finger. There was no epidemic where unemployment and drug addiction predominated in our community. It was no different in Philadelphia just on a larger scale. Anytime a African American was seen on TV or the big screen we supported them, including when Bill Cosby showed up as a Tennis Pro. I remember going to see Sidney Poitier, “In the Heat of the Night.” Where he slapped that white man and everyone gasped. That is something we had never seen on the Big Screen. Bill Cosby holds a revered place in our community, but is not above criticism. None of us are perfect and he knew when coming out with those statements there was going to be backlash. I am sure he can stand it.

        2. roylee47 says:

          I’m sure he will be okay. We just can’t afford to focus all on what he said, and how he said it so much that we get pir collective tires stick in the mud. We must spot out the bone, and retain what is chewable and nutritional.
          The beauty of it is that it has spawned the wonderful dialogue that has transpired in this post. That in itself is priceless.

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          roylee47 Yes he did!

    2. ajamu chaminuka says:

      roylee47 You make sense!

  62. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

    Bill Cosby is right on EVERY point he made. The problem with black people is that we don’t want to be told the truth and want to wallow in wrong and then be given sympathy for our flawed choices.If YOU made the choice to live in a mess then YOU deal with the mess.
    The advice he is giving is old school, straight from the hip truth!!!

    1. bwdn2008 says:

      ZionMarQuieseDevereaux Yes and unless you are Oprah Winfrey, President Obama or someone of that stature, he is talking to you. The problem with some black folks is they believe he is talking about every black person except them.

    2. CarolParks says:

      I love Bill Cosby, & have great respect for him. I’m old school too! 🙂

      1. TamaraYeldell says:

        CarolParks u r a white woman, what does this have to do with you?  when he goes to the trailer park and starts putting down white mama’s then come back and join the conversation.

        1. bwdn2008 says:

          TamaraYeldell CarolParks Some folks believe if we disagree with any of Cosby’s points we hate him. The media comes out with these headlines about blacks don’t like Cosby. That is BS as we disagree all of the time and it is not about hate or disrespect. Bill Cosby is one of us and within the black community we have Conservatives, Progressives, Liberals, and an admixture of the three. We argue Social Issues, Politics, and Religion all of the time and still sit down and eat dinner together. We understand that but Ms. Parks wants to take it to another level, by chiding us for disagreeing with Mr. Cosby. This is how we do it Ms. Parks!

        2. whitebl09 says:

          TamaraYeldell CarolParks Forreal though?? That’s what’s really ignorant of you. This lady has only given thought provoking comments. Granted, being white you are not going to know what it is to walk in a Black person’s shoes but that doesn’t mean she oblivious to the plight.When I was in school, I had many great black teachers but some of the most passionate ones I had were white as well because they realized the potential in their students and wanted to tap into all of it. The point I’m trying to make is, this sister is in the same fight with us don’t bring in the negativity. Now it’s ironic that you try to bash Cosby for being condescending yet that’s how you were to this lady.

        3. CarolParks says:

          TamaraYeldell, now that was not a very nice thing to say. I am very involved with the AA community. They are my friends, neighbors, along with many other cultures that are friends, and neighbors. We are all working together to make our community better. Have a nice evening.

        4. CarolParks says:

          Not at all. I have offered some real solutions to help with each community’s problems. Check. It out. It actually works. 🙂

        5. CarolParks says:

          Oh, and BTW that is how everyone does it. Argues about everything, & then later has dinner together.

        6. CarolParks says:

          Thank-you very much for your kind reply. I am very involved with my neighborhood, & community, which is very diverse. AA, Hispanic, Arabic, Asian, & more. 🙂 I only have good intentions, & I don’t mean any disrespect. Have a lovely evening.

        7. TamaraYeldell says:

          CarolParks I wasnt saying it to be nice or to be mean.  I simply stated a fact.  It is wonderful that you are involved in your community and you are probably a lovely lady, but you can not possibly understand how his comments may affect struggling black mothers in low-income neighborhoods who are doing their best with their family.  Not everyone needs to be in every conversation.

        8. TamaraYeldell says:

          whitebl09 TamaraYeldell CarolParks first off Ignorant is when you start with the name calling ok?  Secondly, very good that she is involved with her community, that still doesn’t make her an authority on being a black woman.  She seems to be chiding us for disagreeing with Bill, because she doesnt know what its like to be a single black mother raising a family in a low income neighborhood and doing her best.  How dare Bill put that mother down and how dare Carol (the community leader) chide us for disagreeing with him.  You call that ignorant?  I say to you, “go sit down somewhere”.

        9. JamesHarvin says:

          whitebl09 TamaraYeldell CarolParks  Thank you for these comments.  I had trouble coming up with the words to make the point you made.  Reading Carol Parks’ comments it’s obvious that she if thoughtful and cares about the issues.  Yet, some of us spurn her and get mean because she’s white.  When it’s done to us, we don’t like it.

        10. CarolParks says:

          Well, if we can forget the color, & just read the comment for what it is, maybe there could be a few solutions. I have written on here, how you can make your community better, & take the power back, & make your voices heard. Many across the country are doing this. Each community has individual problems, that should be addressed. If people can get together in their communities, maybe they can find solutions, and make the powers that be hear your concerns. We all have a real interest for Everyone to be successful, and offer all children a better future. Working together is really not so bad.

        11. CarolParks says:

          People can be “mean”, I don’t pay attention to that. There is much more important issues then that, & I’m tough! 😀

        12. CarolParks says:

          I’m not an authority on anything. Just giving some opinions like anyone else. And hoping that people can come together in their own communities, and maybe getting some solutions. When people work together, more things can get done. And you can make the police, political leaders listen to your demands. Oh, and I am not chiding anyone. I don’t know , you are right, but I can imagine it is not easy. And another reason to have a strong community to help each other. And most important, to make sure all children have a chance in life.

        13. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks That is why we keep having a disconnect. What makes your community so great that you can tell me and my community what to do. Isn’t your community where the Mass Murderers (Ted Bundy, Jefferey Dahmer, John Wayne Gacy, BTK, Green River Killer, and others like the Oklahoma City Bomber came from. I have not even touched on the recent killings in Boston, Colorado (Holmes), Arizona (Loughner), Connecticut, and so many more. Well as long as they are not walking around with sagging pants I guess it is okay to murder innocent Americans.  Fortunate for you and other whites, those crimes only count as one in Americas memory. So if 20 young blacks are murdered in Urban Areas and 20 mass murderers kill an average of 5 people, they are considered equal. Your community is in need of cleaning up and we (African Americans), need to work on our own issues. Natives put their trust in Europeans and wound up living on Reservations in their own Country. Our Ancestors put their trust in your people and wound up on slave ships headed for America.

        14. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          As I said before, and your recent comment proves it, you do not know enough about the issues from your vantage point. You say the right things, they sound good and I agree with some of your statements. The problem, however, is that you are looking at the surface not the root cause. Sure, coming together is an important step but the black community is divided by class and few whites care to understand the true causes and needed solutions in the black community. Anytime someone tries to have an honest discussion about how racially oppressive policies create significant barriers, it is considered playing the race card. They do not want to be bothered with issues that seem so long ago and do not affect them. In other words, it is not as simple as you think and race and class do matter.
          Most important is Obama’s lack of concern about issues affecting the black community. Use that “it’s an American issue” all you want. Mass incarceration, failing school, the closure of dozens of schools, and the lack of employment opportunities in inner cities is a black issue because blacks are affected in way other racial and minorities groups are not. But Obama refuses to intervene with policy reform. He intervenes for other racial and minority groups. Why not intervene on behalf of black communities.  
          I want to be clear that your race has nothing to do with my response and point of view. I believe there are some excellent white advocates for social justice who cross racial lines. Tim Wise is a person I feel has a core understanding of black issues and gives it the complexity it deserves. With additional knowledge of the issues, your efforts will be better received. Read William Julius Wilson, Cornel West, Michael Eric Dyson and others. Do some research to gain a deeper understanding.

        15. JohnDgdc says:

          CarolParks Carol, Thank you for your concern and commitment.  Some of your “solution” may work.  But what you are not getting is that some of your suggestions are simplistic and naive. I applaud your efforts, but you really cannot understand the gravity of what has happened and continues to happen to blacks in America.  Overall, we are the out-group in an in-group world.  No matter how hard we try, even when we conform to societies mandates, our participation is prescribed.  The perfect example is President Obama.  One well-meaning white woman told me, “Of course he was smart.”  It never crossed her lips, but the real message was, “Of course he was smart; he was half white.”  You really are seeking understanding, but you do not get the nuances.  You sympathize, and we need people who do, but you are not our savior.  You are not the one to present the solutions because you do not understand the complexity of the issues.  Nonetheless, thank you for your support.  Now don’t leave the cause (as a very famous radio personality did) when you hit a rough spot. Stay the course.  Finally, if people seem mean, it is because you do not realize how naive you sound, and they are wondering why you are in this.
          My guess is that you are in your own pain, and one way to soothe pain is to help someone else.  Blessings.

        16. CarolParks says:

          ???????? Bwdn2008, I have no idea what you are talking about. All those serial murderers are from all across the country. My Community, is heavily Integrated. You must not be comprehending my post’s. I’m talking about a Solution for communities out there. And it works. It’s about taking the power back. Anyway, I can’t have a discussion with you, if you don’t take the time to read and understand what I am saying. Solutions are the answer to problems, not attacking people, and wanting to argue. That is useless.

        17. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks Yes i know you don’t claim that element of your society. Yet you continually point out how you can help us with our problems. Most of us are adults and I believe the solution is within our own community. We do not need you to lead us to the promised land.

        18. CarolParks says:

          Bwdn2008 your community, or neighborhood, is more then likely integrated if you live in the Bay Area. But, whether it is or not, the only way you can improve your schools, your lives, and to fix your problems that you may have, is to have meetings & bring your neighbors together to address the problems. This is not my idea, & it actually is happening in many places across the U.S. of course you can instead talk on here forever, but that will accomplish nothing. It’s Action that solves problems. The President himself did this back in Chicago. This is also how he won. I worked for him, & have a lot of knowledge how to improve where you are living. Have a nice evening.

        19. CarolParks says:

          JohnDgdc. President Obama, has an I.Q. Of 160-165. What that White woman thought, doesn’t matter. It’s what you think that matters. I could care less what others think, because each person has to know their own reality, & strength. No one culture has more intellect then another. President Obama has great strength, as does Michelle, because they know their self worth. Never knock simplicity, sometimes it really does work. And thank- you for your concern, but I am not in pain. I am a very happy, & lucky woman. I just happen to love to write. Enjoy your evening! 🙂

        20. JamesHarvin says:

          CarolParks  Nevertheless, personal attacks will never help when discussing the issues.  There’s already a lot of emotion clouding the issues.  Getting nasty just doesn’t help.  I could tell that you care and are tough.  I’ve always thought that part of the problem is that not enough white people care.  It bothers me when black folk attack white folk who do bother to discuss these matters, whether one agrees with them or not.  It’s not fair (or productive) when anyone is treated that way.

        21. CarolParks says:

          Thank- you for your sincere reply Mr. Harvin. It is a shame that people can’t hear what I am saying, because I am White. We all have a vested interest in having an equal, successful, country for all of it’s citizens. We all are human, and of the human race. We have different cultures, but biologically we are the same. How sad it is that we are supposed to hate one another, and all live separately in our own little world. I am so very happy that is not true where I live, and that all of my friends, and neighbors can discuss anything without the malice. But, I certainly did not mean to upset anyone on here, that was not my purpose. I just happen to admire, & love Bill Cosby, & wanted to state my perspective, even though yes, I am White. I hope you have a wonderful weekend! Peace.

        22. CarolParks says:

          Oh, and one more thing Mr. Harvin, many Whites do care very much, and support equality, and improvement’s, programs, better schools, job opportunities , business opportunities for AA. Your success makes a better country, and a better world for all children. It is the GOP Congress, that has stopped a lot of programs, & advancement for AA, & for all poor & even middle class in this country. The President is very limited because of Congress. He can only do so much. If we should get a democratic Congress back next year, I believe he will do great things. I can only hope.

        23. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks Just wanted to correct one statement you made which i think is important. In actual fact, there are not many white people who care enough to support equality otherwise we would have it. There ARE many whites who pretend to be liberal but i think history has shown that  African people in america will never have equal rights with whites. The ultimate solution must be a protracted liberation   campaign of resistance and violence against the forces of oppression until there is a negotiated settlement acceptable to Black people.

        24. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          ajamu chaminuka CarolParks This wouldn’t have been an issue if our ancestors had not wanted to be desegregated and equal.
          If we will never be equal to them we wouldn’t have even had to have been in this if we had of kept it seperate but equal.
          Sometiimes we ask for things and don’t realize what we are asking.
          Do some research.
          We had more then than we do now.
          If there is anyone to be upset at it should be our ancestors.

        25. CarolParks says:

          Ajamu chaminuka, with all do respect, that is your opinion, and not a fact. Just like it is y opinion you are dry wrong. Maybe 20 years ago, you would be correct. But, when Obama, the man you love to hate, :-D…..preached for equality for all, & a new & fair gov. System, with 75,000 & more showing up to see him, & then he was elected with a huge margin of Victory, things had changed, forever. No matter what kind of President you think he is, America voted for him , and it was a landslide. Over 50 % of White men, & I think it was close to 70% of White women voted for him. The day that happened was the day

        26. CarolParks says:

          The Majority of Americans had changed. I believe that most White people here in the U.S., under the. Age of 50, want equality for all. We are not separate here in San Francisco, & the Bay Area. Most of the night clubs , schools, social places are very mixed. Just like the neighborhoods. Despite the old, White, GOP/ Tea Bags, & Fake Fox Lies, most White Americans are not like that. Our real problems in the future will not be about racism, it will be about money. The poor, & the rich. I was hoping Occupy would become a third party because of all the corruption in Gov. But, it doesn’t look that way now. Anyway, this is my opinion on ” the White People”. ;-D

        27. CarolParks says:

          Sorry my iPad self correct’s. ugh! It should read>>> just like it is my opinion, you are wrong.

        28. CarolParks says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux, to be perfectly honest, none of this ” racism”, & all that goes with it, would have even happened, if man himself did not have the Ego, & the ” King of the world, I must conquer attitude” that has always since time began, made one man trying to be the leader. Man wants to be the ruler, & it has done nothing but been destructive to humanity. Even White men were slaves at one time. The White man, because of numbers, has taken over & done horrendous things , more then any other. But, all thru history we have had examples of other cultures destroying people. Like Idi Amin of Ughanda. But, no one has come close to the White mans destruction. Personally, I think the majority of people everywhere are really sick of it, & just want a peaceful world.

        29. CarolParks says:

          Again, my iPad self corrected wrongly, it should read. Uganda.

        30. CarolParks says:

          Ajamu chaminuka, I APOLOGIZE! I was Wrong about the data!
          The good news is that my fellow Caucasians are aging out of their lock-step Republicanism. Obama failed to win a majority of whites (43 percent); or white men (41 percent); or even white women (46 percent), who are more open to voting Democratic. But he won 54 percent of all white voters age 18 to 29, to McCain’s 44 percent. You’ll note from the chart that the white majority among voters has been shrinking during the past 40 years, just as the white majority has shrunk in the general population. The three-point drop since 2004, though, is so dramatic that a likely explanation isn’t demographics at all but rather a greater disinclination than usual among white folks this year to vote. Turnout in 2008 was about what it was in 2004, and, according to the Center for the Study of the American Electorate, the reason it wasn’t higher—as widely expected, given the keen interest in this election—was that fewer Republicans went to the polls. The percentage of Democrats who went to the polls increased 2.6 percentage points while the percentage of Republicans went down 1.3 percentage points. The greatest favor the white race did Obama this year may have been to stay home. That’s a far cry from Martin Luther King’s dream, but it’s a start.

        31. CarolParks says:

          Resolved QuestionShow me another »
          WERE WHITE PEOPLE THE ORIGINAL SLAVES (sources included)?
          The word “slave” comes from the word “Slav”, a group of whites more enslaved throughout history than any other people – The Dictionary. The term “Slav” became the root of the word “slave” in almost every culture, because it was assumed your slave was a Slav. The slave traders were Jews and the primary enslavers were Arabs.
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_medieval_Europe
          Nell Irvin Painter – professor Emerita at Princeton University, winner of some Edwards award, and author of several books on black history (yep, she’s African American and yep, she hates white people) says this about slavery in the American colonies in her book “The History of White People” published just last year – 2010:
          “By the middle of the 17th century, when Virginia’s slave population numbered 11,000, only some 300 were African. Any of them – African, British, Scottish or Irish – were lucky to outlive their terms of service. Of the 300 children shipped from Britain between 1619 and 1622, only 12 were still alive in 1624.” So 2 to 5 years later, 288 had died.
          Slavery was a GLOBAL phenomenon.
          There were 4 white slaves for every black 1 in the American colonies – “White Cargo: The Forgotten History of Britain’s White Slaves in America” by Don Jordan and Michael Walsh;
          “Eighteenth-Century White Slaves: Fugitive Notices; Volume I, Pennsylvania, 1729-1760 (Documentary Reference Collections)” by Daniel Meaders
          More than half of all indentured servants never lived to see their freedom – “They Were White and They Were Slaves: The Untold History of the Enslavement of Whites in Early America” by Michael A. Hoffman II
          And Africans enslaved Europeans first, as well as during, the American enslavement of Africans (more than a million white slaves captured in pirate raids) – “Christian Slaves, Muslim Masters: White Slavery in the Mediterranean, the Barbary Coast and Italy, 1500-1800 (Early Modern History)” by Robert C. Davis;
          “White Slaves, African Masters: An Anthology of American Barbary Captivity Narratives” by Paul Baepler
          http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/mar/11/highereducation.books
          One huge difference is that white slaves were not allowed to reproduce. White male slaves in the Ottoman Empire were forcibly made eunichs, and many of them died from the forced castration. Even in America, the white slaves who were political prisoners from Ireland (shipped beginning in 1655 by Henry Cromwell), were often worked to death in the sun, called “redshanks”, “rednecks”, and “redlegs” before they expired from the heat. (“The ‘Redlegs’ of Barbados” by Jill Sheppard).
          Less than 4% of African slaves ever even wound up in America. Most of them wound up in Brazil.
          http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2011/01/07/fascinating-database-about-the-trans-atlantic-slave-trade/
          No, whites did not invent slavery, but they DID invent abolition.
          The American Colonization Society, founded in 1816, was supposed to relocate freed black slaves to Liberia, and raised a great deal of money towards that effort, including from private donations. No other country has ever offered freed slaves anything except freedom, which the slaves were grateful for! The ACS founded and colonized land in Liberia, and then resettled more than 13000 freed black slaves, but the process was cut short. The American government had donated more than $250,000 to the effort, a chunk of money at the time.
          Source(s):
          http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-446654/Revealed-Britains-white-child-slaves.html
          http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/mar/11/highereducation.books
          http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2011/01/07/fascinating-database-about-the-trans-atlantic-slave-trade/
          http://www.corbisimages.com/Enlargement/IH171039.html
          2 years ago Report Abuse

        32. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks You need to take that to another board and sell it to somebody that doesn’t know any better. I am the author of three books detailing my ancestors to Colonial Virgina and beyond. Some of my ancestors were Free Blacks in Virginia  and others were slaves in Virginia and South Carolina. Whites came to the America’s as indentured servants who served seven year indentures and then received land and slaves. There were no whites working in the tobacco and fields of Virginia. There were no whites working in the cotton and rice fields of South Carolina, or with Indigo. All of the cooking, cleaning, child rearing, and labor was done by blacks whether slave or free. The Mulattoes in my family were by and large children of white males. They were born free but the laws changed and they were forced by law to serve indentures (30 years for females, 20 years for males), any children born during the servitude were also indentured out. There was never more whites as slaves in America than Africans or Natives (yes Natives too were enslaved). The children of a slave woman were born into slavery, while the children of a free woman were born free. When the Mulatto Population increased they tried to change the laws in order to utilize the growing labor force. You are way off telling me about my own history, which I have study, researched, and written about. That is what makes you look like a racist, or someone who is clueless about American History. BTW when did your people come to America? We know that most whites entered in the 1870’s through Ellis Island. The majority of whites that came to the Americas were Europes landless peasants and inmates who were sent to the Colony’s as punishment. Where does your family fit in, since you want to debate about history?

        33. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks You are leaving out the black men who have been killed by Police in the Bay Area. Kenneth Harding, James Rivera, Idriss Stelley, Oscar Grant, Mario Romero, Raheim Brown, and many more. They were all shot by white police officers, for no reasons. Some of the families have received settlements and others are still in court. Hunters Point is the target of Gentrification where they are moving out blacks to move in Wealthy Whites. Kenneth Harding was shot because he did not have a $2.00 transfer. The police executed him and would not let anyone render assistance as he lay dying. Maybe it is paradise for you over there, but let the African Americans speak for themselves. The ones I speak to come from all socio and economic backgrounds and they are under siege. They cannot even move to Oakland because it is also under Gentrification. So please do not come on the board as if you are the only one that can speak for what is going on in the Bay Area?

        34. ajamu chaminuka says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux ajamu chaminuka CarolParks the answer is that history moves the way it moves, hindsight as they say is 50-50. It’s perfectly human to want to be equal and not dominant but history has shown what it has shown. Your conclusion that it’s at our forbears that we should be upset is incorrect because it assumes that  we had complete control of our destiny independent of history and concrete conditions, and that we should have been able to see the future. It blames the victim for being in the situation they are caught up in and furthermore what possible good can it do at this point to make such a statement?  How does blaming our ancestors for anything helps us? What we have to do is not blame but understand and move forward!

        35. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks Carol, my opinion is just my opinion true, but it is based on recent history and observable facts by someone who has been engaged in the Black struggle for décades. My observation tells me that Black people are worse off now in many ways than we were when we were segregated. That is not to say that segregation was better. It is to say that we lost a lot of the solidarity that we had to have back in the day to survive. Economic solidarity, social etc. Furthermore, the fact of Barack Obomber receiving many white votes and most Black votes and after five years seeing not only no progress but regression on all levels tells me that that is not the way to achieve true freedom. Objective observation leads me to conclude that we, the oppressed Black nation, will have to take matters into our own hands in a radical manner. We cannot depend on whites to help us free ourselves froml white domination because most whites are too deeply infected with the disease of racism/white supremacy.

        36. ajamu chaminuka says:

          CarolParks Carol, True that my opinion is just my opinion but it is based on décades of observation and involvement in the Black struggle. The reality overall is that Black people are worse off now than during segregation in terms of social, economic, and ideological solidarity. Regardless of Obombers victory and percentages of votes from various communities, we are worse off now than when he took office. White people will never help Black people achieve equality because it is against their deeply ingrained feelings of racial superiority. I have known the most radical and revolutionary whites as a former Black Panther. I have known members of the Weather Underground and other groupings and formations. Even they could not totally eradicate their racism and they would be the first to acknowledge that. You obviously do not fully appreciate the depths of the problem with white people nor the reality of who really controls society.

        37. bwdn2008 says:

          ajamu chaminuka CarolParks I mentioned the white serial and mass killers to Carol to get a reaction from her. It was interesting how she distanced herself from those who commit those acts, like Holmes who shot and killed those people in the theater, the Marathon Bombers, and the white man who killed the kids in Connecticut. Most whites distance themselves from those types of murders, but connect all blacks to the killings in our community. Her reaction was to say they were ALL over the country. Interestingly enough, Obama has not said that white folks need to take control of their community and white fathers should stay home to keep their children from turning into Mass Murderers and spree killers. Carol responded like most whites do because they are never connected to the negative things going on in their community. Whites are always seen as innocent or clueless, while blacks are connected only to what is going wrong in, “Our” Community. Trying to get through to these people is like talking to a Brick Wall. They don’t get it and they don’t want to get it!

        38. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          bwdn2008 CarolParks Bwdn2008, see the only issue with what you stated is that when WHITE men go on these ridiculous rampages other whites seperate themselves SOMETIMES EVEN THE FAMILIES.
          What do black people do?
          We want to stand behind the ridiculous foolishness that some black people do and even condone it.
          Let’s be real here.
          If Zimmerman were black and had killed a white boy this would not even be an issue. We would be even telling people that Zimmerman had a RIGHT to defend himself.
          Stop the hypocritical b.s. and let’s be real about.
          Black people have a double standard that needs to be dead and buried.

        39. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          CarolParks Carol, most black people aren’t concerned with solutions. They would rather sit and complain.

        40. CarolParks says:

          Hi Ajamu, I agree with a lot of what you said.
          But, my point is that until we elected Barack Obama, we have had Only a predominately Old, White, mostly male, government. With the President, Eric Holder, Susan Rice, & now many women & others, our Gov., is at least changing to reflect the people in the U.S. The more women, minorities, & different religious, or non religious people we have in Gov., the better it will be. The Whites will soon be a minority in America, as the Hispanics become the majority. These old, White, out of touch politicians need to go. There are a few good ones, but mostly they all are corrupt. We really need a new, non corrupt party that truly represents everyone’s interest’s. we do not have anything close to that with the GOP, & the Dem’s.
          You speak a lot about violence, but that can never solve the problem. The real answer is using the system to your advantage. And changing the political landscape. The Occupy Movement, I believe really woke a lot of people up. But, it is a new political party with real term limits that represents All Americans, that needs to come into power.
          The American Indians, living on horrid reservations, with poverty, terrible living conditions, & lousy schools, figured a way out by having all these Casino’s. the Hispanic’s who are fighting for equality also, the maligned Muslims, and so many more, are also fighting against this horribly corrupt system. Most of the White youth in colleges across the nation, and ones not in college want changes, & say the system is corrupt. The For Profit Prison System, the Whole Legal System, not having the real history of this country taught in schools, and all of the empty promises of politicians, that never deliver. Someone said, if they were to legalize pot, 1/2 the population of the prison system would empty. Now, to me no one should be in prison for having or smoking weed. To me that is insane. And the prison conditions are horrific, & the rehabilitation does not exist.
          So, when I state on here, that each community can start to slowly take back the power, & I am told I am naive’ , or it’s too simple of an idea for the real problems at hand, I say, it is a start to the vast problems at hand. I am sure you have read how a few older women were so mad, & upset with the gangs in their project, they actually after a year got them out of their area. So, Anything can be done, if you really want change. It’s Never easy, but the results are well worth it. My main focus has always been on the children. They are so innocent, and they deserve a safe, and nourishing environment, so that they might thrive.
          This horrendous killing of our children in Chicago, Needs To Be Addressed Now, & Stopped. It should be on Every News Station nightly, until there is a solution. Every Political Leader there, & every Church Leader there, as well as the police, should be held responsible for these children getting hurt, or killed.

        41. bwdn2008 says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 CarolParks The point you missed is I stated that, “Whites” lump us all together. They separate themselves from the crimes of whites, but lump us together when a crime is committed by blacks. My concern is equal justice if you are going to attack people than do it equally. I have seen too many crooked cops who are leaving dangerous people on the streets because they are, Informants.  If they are going to set up task forces then go after Serial Killers and Mass Murderers like they do to remove so called Gang Members. Go after the people who are supplying guns to the inner city youth, and charge them with conspiracy. That is what is, “Not” Being done! BTW whites who are serial killers, Mass Murders, Spree Killers, and rapists, don’t wear saggy pants. No they walk among us, in suits, ties, and casual clothes, and they blend in.  That is why they are able to commit their crimes with such efficiency.  More people are killed by Mass Murderers, Spree Killers, and Serial Killers, then in black areas. But each crime is counted as one. So they talk about the one person who committed all of those crimes, instead of all of the people killed (12 in Connecticut). That is what I am trying to get you to wrap your mind around, that you are being hoodwinked and are blind to what is really going on.

        42. CarolParks says:

          No, it is Not about blaming our Ancestors, my statement was more about men’s need to be dominant. And it creates, the racism, and other problems that we still have today. It is an ongoing problem. Think about it. Fights, games, men & women, political races, everything is about who is the best, who can win, who is the leader. It promotes the idea that you have to convince yourself that you are the better person.

        43. CarolParks says:

          Whites and Hispanics, older people of all nationalities have also been abused, and killed by the police. This is not what my subject matter was. I have my opinion, you have yours. Oakland has many different neighborhoods. By Lake Merritt the Laotians have moved in and represent how things are changing. But, Oakland is still majority AA. I’m there a lot. You do not know me, nor my friends, family, or who I am connected with. Your very negative spin on everything is not reality. You keep referring to Hunters Point. That whole area was horrific for anyone to live in during the 1970’s, when they first tried to put new condo’s on Jerome Street. On the top of Hunters Point at that time, there was no electricity, boarded up homes, garbage everywhere, and you could murder someone because the police wouldn’t even go in there most of the time. I know many AA people who are thrilled that area is and has been cleaned up. That was not a safe, nor a place that anyone would want to live. And these opinions are from AA, not me although I do agree with them. I am not the only one speaking her, & you have every right to your own opinions, but you do not need to continually attack me because I do not agree with you. Your negativity, does not promote solutions.

        44. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks It appears that you are defending slavery by saying everyone did it! I don’t believe  you are intentionally doing that, but that is the way it is coming threw. The one ancestor I traced back to Guinea West Africa was twelve years old, when the slavers kidnapped her and the children in her village. The slavers who took her were white, and they put her on board a Dutch Ship. She was taken to Bermuda and seasoned before being sold to her white, “Master” in South Carolina. Most of the slaves taken from Africa were children and teens. The man who wrote Amazing Grace, was a white man, who owned a slave ship. He got a conscious after seeing African children in pens, waiting for slave ships. He quite the slave trade and wrote that song, which was about his awakening to the evils of slavery. Black people sing that song in church, but it was a song written by and for whites who supported slavery. No one had slaves for life before Europeans captured and brought Africans to the Americas. The concept of someone owning another human being was unheard of and was  unique to Europeans. There were captives in African Villages, who may have been at best servants, but they were let go or made a part of the tribe. Europeans actually justified slavery by saying that, “God” ordained it in the Bible. They took an African Jesus, turned him white and fed him up to churches throughout Europe. Then it was okay to take native lands because they were savages and heathen, and it was okay to enslave Africans for the same reason. After all we were cursed by God and we, African Americans, brought into it.

        45. CarolParks says:

          Hi ZionMarQuieseDevereaux, well, I believe that most people, whether AA or anyone want solutions, but are unsure how to attain them. I will not answer the ” off topic”, serial killer statement by the other poster because it has nothing to do with my statement about communities, including mine. when I say community, I am not talking about the whole country, but rather my immediate neighborhood. Which is heavily diverse. So, the serial killers, are not from my neighborhood. Lol! But, it is a fact that serial killers are about 95% White, & mostly male. That is true. But, we are talking about solutions for bettering people’s lives. And BTW, every culture, including White has problems with poverty, teen pregnancies, drugs, etc. this is not a problem that only happens to AA. But, our Gov., & their policies, I agree hurt the AA communities more, and are racist in the way the law applies, & everything connected with it. We have a long way to go to have true equality in this country. And, getting rid of all these old, White, GOP, & even some Dem’s & having a much more just, & fair system for all should be everyone’s objective.

        46. CarolParks says:

          Here, you are way off topic, but to enlighten you, here are the statistics. Serial killing represents between 1 to 2% of all killings in America. Now the subject here is about Bill Cosby, & his statements about improving people’s lives. And that starts in your own neighborhood, ( community). Which does not include the entire U.S. and, since you called me a Racist, Do Not Post to Me Again. Your ignorance is truly alarming, as is the hatred you are promoting.

        47. CarolParks says:

          Regular Photo Size
          advertisement
          SHARETHIS
          Posted: 03/02/2011
          By: By THOMAS HARGROVE, Scripps Howard News Service
          Just how common is serial murder in America?
          “Serial murder is a relatively rare event, estimated to comprise less than 1 percent of all murders committed in any given year,” supervisors at the FBI’s famed Behavioral Analysis Unit concluded in their published summary of a 2005 symposium the bureau sponsored in San Antonio, Texas.
          That little-known but historically important gathering attracted 135 veteran homicide investigators, scholars and government crime experts.
          The group reached an important agreement that serial murder should be defined as “the unlawful killing of two or more victims by the same offender in separate events.” Until then, there was no consensus on how many deaths were required for a series of homicides to qualify.
          Several participants at that meeting said the broad definition — which they believe certainly encompasses more that 1 percent of all homicides — was adopted out of concern that serial killings are often overlooked by police.
          “We underestimate the prevalence of serial murder,” concluded Jack Levin, co-director of Northeastern University’s Brudnick Center on Violence and Conflict and a national expert on serial killing. “It is hard for police to admit they have a serial killer on the loose since it terrifies the public. After all, serial killers are the most successful kind of killer. They frequently stay on the loose for months, years or even decades.”
          The FBI reports it has 1,398 cases of known serial homicides among the more than 60,000 homicides reported since 1985 to its Violent Crime Apprehension Program in Quantico, Va. That figure represents more than 2 percent of the homicides on file with the bureau.
          Read more: http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/local_news/special_reports/How-many-unsolved-homicides-are-due-to-serial-killers_47076783#ixzz2XjNfcOIA

        48. CarolParks says:

          Bwdn2008, calling people, ” these people” is a very racist statement. And that is in your own post. I have Nothing more to say to you.

        49. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks No my negativity is not bothering you it is that you don’t want anyone to challenge what you are saying. My son lives by the Lake and there are white gentrifiers moving in, causing the rents to be raised. The Laotians have been in the area surrounding the lake, they did not just arrive. You seem like you are bothered that I am challenging your facts. You cannot tell me more about MY Community when you are not part of it. I understand you may have friends in the community but that does not make you part of the community. You did not answer when I asked you when did your people come to America and where did they come from? I will continue to challenge you as long as you are misstating facts. I don’t see you as negative, but as misinformed.

        50. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks I am not off topic, dead is dead! You are talking about black on black crime. Bill Cosby’s son was shot and killed by a White Male, and yet he continues to criticize young black males in the inner city. What you did was separate the Serial killings, Spree Killings, and Mass Murders, numbers of which are played down by the White Males who tally them. Ted Bundy, Jeffrey Dahmer, John Wayne Gacy, BTK, The Green River Killer (killed over 30 women), Oklahoma City Bomber, the Una bomber, James Holmes, Adam Lanza (killed children in Connecticut), Boston Marathon Bombers, Dylan and Kleibold (Columbine Shootings), Joel Rifkin, James Laughner, and Jared Lee Loughner (killed 7 wounded Gabby Giffords), I can go on all day.  Do you know how many people have died from these monsters? No because the media makes celebrities out of the murderers. The Media remembers their names and does not list their victims names. My point is that at no point are whites seen as bad guys by the media, no matter what they do. Most of these guys are described as very intelligent, troubled young men. Yet African American males living in the worst conditions America has to offer are seen as simply, “Bad” and undeserving of understanding. You cannot help if you don’t even know who we are, or  understand our issues. Let us know who you are, where you are coming from, before coming in to tell our young people what, “They” need to do.

        51. CarolParks says:

          One more thing Ajamu, I don’t believe we will all achieve everything we want, because in reality the world is filled with a lot of evil, & that is in everyone’s culture. Man is far from perfect, so we can only achieve a much better life…& world, but never will it be all that we want. Unfortunately, only heaven can offer complete happiness and peace.

        52. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks
          Carol, when we use the phrase “black community” we are referring to all black communities–not only our neighborhood. It is important to understand that we experience life differently and race plays a big part in our existence, so we express our difficulties in terms of race because that is something we face everyday of our lives: That is our burden. 
          White privilege means you never have to think about how race is going to affect your interview, job promotion, or where you live. It means you do not have to worry about being followed in a department store because they think you are there to steal. Once, a store security officer followed me and my family so closely I had to ask him to PLEASE let us shop that were not going to steal: He followed us to the register and out the door. Another time I had a young person stand a few feet from me and stare; he would not move or take his eye off me. He was so focused on me that the real criminals were probably taking anything they wanted. That is what Bwdn2008 was talking about: Blacks receive so much attention based on racial stereotypes that those who commit more horrific crimes go unnoticed. 
          I grew up in a small, segregated community in South Georgia in the 70s. Yes, my community was still segregated. Around 1980, when I turned 10-years-old, my family moved us to a nearby town that was slightly larger but still segregated. I grew up there until the early 90s when I moved to Albany, GA, a city with a small town feel–it was still segregated. Today, I know of towns where blacks, whites, and Hispanics, go to separate proms and never hangout in each others communities. 
          As an adult, I have traveled the United State (and lived in Southern California) s and internationally (currently in Japan). I have learned to appreciate overt racism over covert racism: If I know who the person truly is, I can deal with him or her. I fear the police in many cases as much as I fear the young thug on the street because so many black men have been killed or framed by police for doing nothing at all. 
          As a dark skin male, I am not allowed to forget my race. Do you know how much energy it takes to try and fit into an environment that does not accept your culture, your language or your appearance? Recent is now suggesting that being subjected to racism daily can contribute to health problems. As a program manager for a department of health in New England, I was told my female colleagues did not speak to me in the hallway because they had never seen such a dark skin person in-person: They were afraid. My supervisor informed me. So, I wore a suit everyday–even on causal Friday–and never broke from professional vernacular. When they laid me off, after two years, I was told I had not shown them enough to keep me. I pleaded for more challenging work but never got the opportunity. I was one of two blacks in my division out of 150 people. When my colleague, Charles, the other black guy, was up for promotion to chief, it should have been a formality: MIT graduate, Deputy Chief of the department for 10 years, next in line. Instead, he was passed over for one of his subordinates. She had been on the job for 6 years and did not have the master’s degree required for the position. Nevertheless, she was given the job because, Charles was told, she was a better fit and everyone liked her. Master’s from MIT, ran Boston’s largest medical clinic, deputy chief for 10 years and next in line for the position and the girl  who did  meet the qualifications got the job.
          I could go on. Like the time I was arrested, as I sat on my stoop in front of my apartment, because the police said “A black guy broke into a house not far from here and you are the only one around.” What! The cop slammed my head into the door and threw me in the back seat. About a mile down the road, the car pulled over and the cop said they found the guy. They let me go. No apology and I had to walk home with a Flintstones size knot on my head. 
          The point is that looking at your community and talking to a few black people who live in one community that is not representative of the life experiences of many black people around the country is not helpful to the larger issues black communities face–but you are not referring to a black community but a mixed community, right?. So when you talk about solutions, just be clear that they are only solutions for your community and might not be right for other communities that lack diversity, economic opportunities and so forth.

        53. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          Carole, that is how Bill Cosby referred to poor black people he considers the problem for the ills in the black community: “…these lower economic and middle economic people” (Dyson, 2005). How do you feel about his use of these people?

        54. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee CarolParks Your story is mirrored by my brother who was the target of police from the time he was a teenager. We lived in a small town in Pennsylvania and things were pretty good until my parents seperated. My brother was always an A Student in school and in classes with mostly whites. When he was in Junior High School a white girl said he showed himself to her. My brother was taken out of our home and sent away until he was 15 years old. When he came back we were in another town and they had profiled him because of his record. He had no peace as they were always following and throwing him in jail. When he was 17 they threw him in the county jail for vandalism and when he got in a fight with a white man, they accused him of starting a riot and sent him to the Eastern Penitentiary where he remained for two years. It did not matter that our family had influence or he was a bright student. He was black and that is why he was targeted. My brother, sister, and I decided we were going to learn about American History, and why these whites were so racist. That is when things changed for my brother and he enrolled in College, and now has Advanced Degrees from Stanford and Harvard. As an educated black man those experiences serve him well as he travels in America and overseas (now in Japan). Things did not change until we gained self knowledge, and our young people by and large, do not have that. I see a lot of angry young black men especially in the inner cities and have empathy for them. I don’t mean that I drop my defenses but I do understand where the anger and frustration is coming from. I know that your story is true as I saw it lived out in my own family.

        55. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee CarolParks 
          Thanks for sharing.

        56. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 chamberslee CarolParks 
          PS: I Attended USC so I understand your brother’s journey struggle and triumph.

        57. JamesHarvin says:

          CarolParks   I think you’re correct when you say that President Obama’s election changed things.  His election certainly was a step in the right direction.  However, I’d suggest that the change was not as drastic as some might what to believe.  While President Obama received lots of support from white Americans, it cannot be ignored that his mother is white and his father is an immigrant.  I have heard with my own ears, and heard of, white who considered one or both of those fact important in their regard for the President.  Mr. Obama, whom I support, is not the descendant of slaves.  When the United States elects a descendant of slaves with number similar to those that elected the President, then one might be able say a “forever” change has been made.
          It should not be forgotten that taking Mr. Obama’s heritage into account, his election still raised comments such as, “take OUR country back”, “he’s lazy,  “food stamp President” etc.  All statements prominent person’s made.  Also, none of the prominent republicans denounced the racial comments made by the “fringe”.

        58. JamesHarvin says:

          CarolParks  You are so correct about the Congress.  That’s why I say we must always be vigilant and vote in EVERY election.  This radical repub congress mostly got in during mid-term elections. We elected Mr. Obama and some of us thought we’d done our part.  We must remember that the radical repubs never sleep and will stop at NOTHING to have their way and to gain power.

        59. CarolParks says:

          Hello Chamberslee,
          Before I answer you, I would like to say, that I believe many on here have a wrong impression, mostly because they do not really know who they are speaking to, and what that person knows or doesn’t know, or experiences.
          With that being said, and without revealing a lot about my personal life, which I don’t do online, I willl try & give you the best answers I can.
          First, I understand very well that people say community as in all the AA “community”, across the U.S. But, anyone reading my post’s could understand that I was referring to individual communities,and neighborhoods, with each one having different issues.
          There is a lot of emotion on here, and lot’s of post’s referring to things that really do not offer solutions. Speaking out is wonderful, but solutions are badly needed, especially with children dying everyday, or being stopped, or going to jail. I was talking about how each, small neighborhood, or community could have the people that are interested that actually live there, get together and hopefully have some kind of leadership thru a Pastor, or a political person, or just someone that can lead, and that people trust.
          A neighborhood gathering that has meetings at least twice a month to discuss the issues and the problems in that particular neighborhood. Then eventually to find a competant Attorney that can be on call for problems that happen so everyone has access to an Attorney that normally wouldn’t have. Before you say that is impossible, or too simple, etc… It is being done now as I write this. Many people whether broke, or barely making it come up with money every Sunday for their Church. It would be a much better investment in their lives to have an Attorney who could represent them, and help with their struggles.
          If every member in the “neighborhood”, could donate a certain amount every month to keep that Attorney on call it would be well worth it. That would be the first thing. The second would be, to inform the media in that community of the meetings being held to promote solutions. For instance, demanding support for the schools there, and to demand help with gangs if that should be a problem. But, most importantly when people find out that a certain community is getting together, politicians and others take notice. So what you say? Their voices are VOTES for them, so they will listen. And if not, they know there could be a problem come voting time. It is a long process, and NOT a simple thing to do. But, it is possible and it does work. President Obama worked very hard in a poor district in Chicago, long before anyone knew who he was. I am sure you know this. And how he improved the food system there in the schools, and helped many families. He also helped many who could not afford an Attorney. He built a network all across America, and that is exactly how he was elected. I worked for him back in 2007, and 2008.
          The main idea about each community getting together to discuss and fix their individual concerns, is that eventually all these comunity leaders would have conferences, and talk to one another and offer advice, and stories of what worked and what didn’t. The “Tea Party”, got together very fast, and look at the media attention they got. AND THE POWER. This is what I mean, about taking back YOUR POWER. Do I have all the answers? NO. Is this possible? Yes. This is just a short, blueprint of what can start as a great change for the AA in this country. I can’t lead anyone to the “promised land”, as someone on here stated, but I am just sharing a small idea, that I hope might inspire someone to try.
          Living in Georgia for most of your years growing up, I am sure you do not know what I am talking about when I said I grew up in San Francisco. I am 5th generation S.F., by the way.
          My experience couldn’t be anymore different then yours when I grew up. In my neighborhood, and schools we were very integrated, with many cultures, and different religions. I will try and make this short, as this is turning into a book! LOL!
          The very first time I heard someone say something very hurtful to one of my friends, I was 9 years old. I was so angry, and hurt that someone wanted to hurt one of my friends. I have never changed, and continue to feel that way. It may seem simple, but I loved my friends, and to be quite honest I love most people. I have worked for, and stood up for Civil Right’s most of my life. A child in my family was called the N word. It happened in a store, by a woman working there. The very next day I was on the news with about 25 people demanding this person be fired. This happened a long time ago. And to be honest San Francisco is not perfect, but it is easily one of the places in the U.S., that does have great tolerance. I had great support, and this person was fired after a week of protest’s, and threat’s of a law suit.
          I am very familiar with innocent, AA people being followed in stores, and being stopped by police, and on and on. But, never having that happen to me even though I do have AA people in my own family, I cannot know exactly how that is despite understanding how wrong that is.
          White privilege, yes that is a very correct term. And, I have always been for reparations for AA, as I believe that was the worst Holacaust to ever have happened. It would not mkae up for what happened, but it would ACKNOWLEDGE what happened.
          Morgan Freeman sponsered an Integrated Prom in Mississippi a few years back. I was shocked that segregation still existed, even in the South. It is changing though I have been told. Some other small towns in the South are having Integrated proms now, and i believe Georgia is one of the states that recently had this, only I can’t remember the name of the town.
          I have been to the South many times to different places. I thought it was on the right path and not so bigoted. Then I visited a small town, in North carolina. And, WHOOPS There it is. The small towns I believe have not changed as much. Raleigh on the other hand was totally amazing to me, as I saw Integrated couples, and the Jazz Club I visited was integrated. But, I am VERY SURE the South has a long way to go.
          As far as the GOP is concerned, they are a pit of racist’s, interested in MONEY only. And the next election. I will not speakl of them on here, because then you would see me use some language that really isn’t “proper”, to use on a Blog! LOL! Have a wonderful evening! 😀

        60. CarolParks says:

          Oh, & just to be clear, I did state Many times that each community is different, with different concerns. But, that they address their individual concerns, & try to come up with solutions. We can’t fix everything, but we can fix something’s. my biggest concern is for the children that is where my heart is.

        61. CarolParks says:

          The use of “those people, or these people” , is very insulting whether you are referring to Whites, AA, or any culture. I refuse to acknowledge people who speak to me like that, or call me a racist, or other names. I speak civilly to everyone, and expect the same. I believe if Mr. Cosby used that term, he was very wrong. Poverty, gangs, drugs, crime is not just in AA neighborhoods, it is in all cultures in this country. I loved ” The Cosby Show”, & always thought Mr. Cosby was a great example to everyone, not just AA. I came on here to defend him. But, if he said that, hopefully he didn’t mean it.

        62. CarolParks says:

          Hi James,
          I think we all are disappointed, that not everything turned out the way we thought, once Obama was elected. The 2010 election turned the tide against this President. Such Hatred, Bigotry, & the GOP, ( I call them Repukes ) refusing to work with him, & to Ignore what the Majority of people voted for in this country has been a nightmare. And many of the Democrat’s did not have his back either. I Thank-God Michelle has his back, and gives him all the support he needs. No wonder with all the hell he has been thru with Congress, Fake Fox Lies, & all the others, his hair is turning white. And those ignorant, White Trash Tea Bags wanting their country back can Leave our country! We are the Majority. And Whites have always been the Majority receiving food stamps. I could go on forever, but lucky for you I won’t. :-D. Enjoy the evening!

        63. CarolParks says:

          James, one more quick comment. Our Government Needs to reflect the make- up of All the cultures, religions, & women too. This all White, Old, living in a bubble, Government needs Drastic Changes. Starting with the Legal System, Education, jobs, & more. And yes, addressing the problems of AA and having Solutions. Soon, Whites will be the minority. I wonder if Bonehead & Eric Cantor, the Turtleman, Mitch, & all the others will go into shock! ;-D

        64. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          I lived San Diego North County for  years and attended USC in Orange County and Los Angeles. I have also lived in Rhode Island, Connecticut, Arizona, Florida and Michigan. I understand what it means to live in a mixed community where there is less focus on race because there are fewer people of color in those communities. A mixed communities tends to have more influence than a predominately black community has. And I know what is like like living in a communities that neglected by local and state representatives. 
          You are talking about community organizing of which I have studied and agree with as a tool to move communities in a better directions. But you said some things in your suggestions about applying solutions that are questionable and highlight a lack of understanding about many “black” communities. Now if you are still referring to your mixed San Francisco community, there is no need for me to address it further because it only applies in your space or community, which is good for you and the residents that are benefiting from your efforts. 
          PS: I am familiar San Francisco’s history of liberalism. In the bible belt, religion is taken seriously. You would have offended the vast majority of the community with the premise that they should give their money to a better cause instead of church. African American’s are VERY religious. That is what I meant by telling to learn more about black people. Again, if you are only talking about your community, disregard my comments on the matter.
          Also, there is a history of black being taken advantage of by so-called leaders that you need to understand and how it affects their ability to trust.

        65. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          You said “if” Cosby said it you hope he did not mean it. He not only said it, REPEATEDLY, he meant and means it, today. Read “Is Bill Cosby Right? Or Has the Black Middle Class Lost Its Mind?” by Dr. Michael Eric Dyson (2005). Google Cosby statements to the Black Caucus in 2004 and you will find the transcript. This is how you address doubt instead of wounding if it is fact or opinion: It is Fact, not opinion.

        66. CarolParks says:

          Ok, Chamberslee, I hear what you are saying. I also know about the “bible Belt”, and that most AA are very religious. My premise was, with all the kids, some babies being killed. Others abused by the police, & some put in jail, yet they are innocent, that for a time parent’s, or moms, or grandparents, would be upset, & desperate enough to take action by having an Attorney available. Offended? Yes, & how offended are people whose children are being slaughtered in the streets?
          In high school, my very best friend, Ann whose family is from Shreveport, LA. And her family is creole & every color of the rainbow. Almost everyday her & I went to her Grandmother’s who we called MaMa. She lived in the project’s in the lower Mission. It was all AA. She was my inspiration growing up. Anyway, long story short she lost her son, he was shot. Later on my girlfriends boyfriend was mistaken for someone else, & he too was killed. Finally, her daughters got her into a different place. But, there were several people who lived there that got sick of the killings. Long story short, with a lot of outside help, they got the gangs out of that building. You have to figure out in life no matter who you are, what is your #1 Priority. For them it was the kids. I never said it was easy, but everyday that goes by another child, sometimes many are senselessly killed. If that doesn’t inspire action, and change to do something about it, nothing ever will.
          No offense, but it seems you want to put up obstacles, and excuses instead of solutions. This is more about people living in Violence, & losing children everyday ( Chicago) , & really no matter the culture, or the ” we do things this way”, none of that should matter. The dying of our children, or losing their lives to a prison, is the main priority. How much help, how many listen to you when you are not alone, & belong to a strong community, with Legal representation? That gives the children who live there a real chance. Support one another, & you can make a huge difference. The Leaders each community picks. A pastor, or someone they can trust.

        67. CarolParks says:

          James, it’s just my opinion, but I really believe the GOP, are self destructing. We can only hope.

        68. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks
          Carol, you come across as condescending toward the people you say you want to help, and that is why some people on the post have written you off in the worst terms. You seem indifferent about African American culture and experiences, as though it does not matter to you because you are too focused on solutions. You can talk about helping children and providing solutions but you are not viewed as a friend of the African American community if you refuse to listen–you have to stop thinking you know it all and have all the answers. You gain the community’s trust by showing you respect their differences, as you find alternative solutions that do NOT offended the very people you profess to want to help. If I tell you your comments about giving money to an attorney instead of giving money to the church would be offensive to many churchgoing black people, why do you ignore that fact and make additional condescending statements? It is not helpful and does more to discredit you than you apparently know. 
          The first rule of helping a person or groups of people is to take their culture seriously, even if you do not understand it or agree with it: Meet them where they are. The goal is to gain trust to show you are a friend willing to join their fight and that you respect them above all else–even if you disagree with their logic and approach. If you find the people in your community receptive to everything you say, good for you. But a cookie cutter approach does not work when communities and cultures are different.
          I have tried to help you gain a better understanding of black people outside of your community and you refuse to listen. Instead, you accuse me of not wanting  solutions and so forth. That is poppycock. I live the the black experience, daily. And I have studied in great detail how to improve communities. Above all, there must be a specifically defined problem or problems that must be addressed. When I point out what some of the issues are, you determine I do not want solutions because I am bringing up all of these barriers. In that regard, you are no different from the white person who does not care to hear the black problems. To you, it is just making excuses. That is why you could not help people in black communities–outside of your community. Your cookie cutter approach only works in your community where you have knowledge of your community’s issues. I do not care what you did for Obama, you lack the ability to speak to people in poor black communities with different cultures, experiences and expectations. 
          If you tell me you are only talking about your community in San Francisco, you should not have responded to my previous post because I clarified that if that was the case there was need to respond to my comments because I am talking about poor black communities–not mixed race or mixed income communities. Each time I talk about the issues that affect most predominately poor black communities you say you are only referring to your community. I am not referring to your community or any community similar to yours. There is no need to respond if you are not willing to listen to ways to improve you ability to reach communities that are different from yours or if you are only talking about your community. 
          The ability to build rapport and make people feel you genuinely are concerned about their problems is more important than simply having solutions. If the community distrusts you, they will not let you in–no matter how effective your solutions may be. 
          Good day.

        69. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee CarolParks My point exactly Lee.

        70. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee CarolParks This is an issue we are trying to work around here in the Bay Area. When we go into our communities to Activate, the white Liberals attempt to run the movement. There are some that allow us to lead but many just want to push their own agenda. When a remark is made about blacks giving their money to church that is insensitive as most of us were or no someone who is in Church. Many of the whites liberals here in the Bay Area are Atheist and want to push that on African Americans. We see our issue of oppression coming from White Supremacy in all of its’ forms. I was asked to join a Marxist Group here in the Bay Area and told them no thanks I am not looking for another white man to follow.  Some of the whites I converse with are liberal but have racists family members at home. I told them the same thing I told Carol to go back to their communities and make changes. The solution to our dilemma has to come from within, not from outsiders pushing their agendas on our community. She does not get it!

        71. CarolParks says:

          Chamberslee,
          You have put down AA on here also, not just me. It is because you do not like anyone having a different opinion or idea then yours. Some may call that arrogance.
          But, it doesn’t matter. I am not just working in San Francisco, I am working all over the country. The ” communities” I am referring to, when I say mixed or diverse has a lot more then one or two AA, as you stated. And we have other cultures as well. But, I have worked in Chicago, New York, & other places where the community was 90% AA. Surprise, I and others were very well received.
          You Sir, look for the negativity always in life. I look for the positive. And I see the result’s. So, you may go on and continue to disregard everyone who has a different approach then you, and continue to comment on here forever. But, that accomplishes nothing. I prefer to see results. I would suggest you look and read what you wrote to others on here that did not agree with you. They were AA, and it looks like they are no longer posting on here. They I assume did not want to waste their time, & neither do I. Peace

        72. CarolParks says:

          I meant to say, that you put down AA, and not just me as in you put us both down, or tried to because of our differences in ideas. I will no longer comment to you. You really are part of the problem, by disregarding everyone’s opinions except your own. Good-bye.

        73. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee CarolParks She is showing her true colors! As soon as you stated you were educated, she had no more use for you. That is what I find dealing with so-called Liberals here in the Bay Area. As long as they are dealing with black folks who they feel superior to it is fine. As soon as someone with education or intelligence comes along they attack. Which is what Ms. Parks just did to you. They are not going to let any AA tell them what to do. The community’s in San Francisco are under Gentrification, getting rid of blacks and replacing them with so-called Middle Class Whites. Hunters Point, Fillmore, Western Edition, all of these areas are under gentrification. No one outside of ourselves has the solution to what is going on in our communities.

        74. JamesHarvin says:

          CarolParks  I put this comment here because I do not understand how these comments are ordered.  I read a comment from someone to you where he criticized you for putting forth solutions.  On its face that seems contrary and impractical, but he does have a point, to a degree.
          Building trust is extremely important.  The methods for building that trust I have found sometimes elusive.  Years ago, I read an article on male female relations.  It talked about the male inclination to what to solve problems when sometime a woman just wants the man to listen.
          Commiseration is extremely important.  The question is, how much is enough.  For some, that’s all they want, and all they want anyone to do.  I like to use a spilled-milk analogy.  Some only want to talk about how spilled the milk.  Then, others are ready to grab a towel and sop up the milk.  
          Sadly, others will never respect anything you have to say regardless.  I can tell from your comments that you know and understand all of this.  I appreciate the fact that you hang in there.

        75. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          Carol, I responded to you with a desire to help you further your understanding of poor black communities–not racially, ethnically or economically diverse communities. So I am very specific about my focus. I point out problems because there must be a starting point. I understand strategic planning and community inclusive where the concerns, culture and expectations of people in the community MUST be taken seriously, as not to offend the very people you are supposedly trying to help.  You refuse to acknowledge this point. Instead, you resort to accusations and arrive at unfounded conclusions that have no bases. 
          Any person who disregards a community’s culture and makes insensitive statements is not a person who is genuine about helping that community. 
          You are an idiot…please, stop talking. I will not comment to you anymore and you do me the same favor. A waste of time.

        76. chamberslee says:

          JamesHarvin CarolParks 
          No one is criticizing Carol for putting forth solutions. The criticism is for thinking solutions trump respect, sensitivity and understanding of the people she is supposed to be helping. I gave her the benefit, thinking she truly wants to help make a difference in poor black communities but she does not. She wants to make herself feel good. 
          If you tell me people in you community would be offended if I  showed up out of nowhere and started offending them, regardless of what my intentions are, I would ask you what do you think is the best approach since this is your community and you understand the culture better than I do. Why would I defer to you? Because it is not about me but the people in distress. I would not continue to insult them and try and push my ideas on them because I think I know best. 
          She has no credibility because she refuses to understand the very people she is trying to help. I am a criminologist and a clinical social worker working to improve communities and ensure social justice. I rely on evidence-based practices that have been proven to work because they are based on validity and reliability. Her approach does work and lacks credibility. It would cause more harm than good.

        77. CarolParks says:

          JamesHarvin CarolParks 
          Hello James,
          Thank-you for your comments. I hate to disappoint everyone, but so far I have had wonderful luck or maybe it’s  just people’s attitude of where I go they are so desperate for solutions. In either case I am thrilled to be involved in something that is helping, but Unfortunately it is just a small piece of what needs to be done.
          Mr. Chambers has told others they are not correct, and they were AA, and have left this board. It is not about who is right or wrong, it is about many opinions, and having the respect that not everyone is going to agree with you. I do not put people down who disagree with me. But, I do not like people who call names, or tell a very lovely AA Lady on here that I was wrong to tell her she would make a great Community Leader, because she was too “simple”. Talk about insulting. You see James, I treat everyone the same. I treat people the way I want to be treated.
          Some things on here that I have said, were twisted to be made into something all together. And if the people that I am involved with in their communities which some are 90% AA  did not trust nor like me, then we would not have had the success we are having. I love it when so many presume everything about me, but have no idea about me whatsoever. They are the ones who do not have a clue as to what is now being done.
          The others that have left were insulted on here for their post’s. That is not something that promotes discussion, and varied ideas. And this notion that I do not undrstand AA when part of my family is, and friends, and community is really insulting. Part of my upbringing was by a wonderful AA Lady, who only had a second grade education, from Shreveport. She was one of the MOST Intelligent people I have ever met. You can have a thousand degrees, but it is how you use your knowledge that count’s. She was a hero of mine.Not to forget that everyone is an individual, and not all AA are the same as no one is.
           I know the real history not the lies this country tells you. Most AA history as I am sure I don’t have to tell you, has never been told in the schools in this country. And for the comment I am trying to tell people what to do, is another insult, as many times in my post’s that are here for anyone to read I say this is just a small idea, and it is NOT even mine, but started by others. I was just sharing.
          But, some are so deep in their negativity or want to argue every little point, and never see the good in anything except their own words is just a waste of time trying to have a conversation especially when they are so ignorant as to call you names, and try &  change the fact’s. Fact’s cannot be changed. You can have an opinion, but you can’t change fact’s. I am speaking of Bwdn2008. It is obvious that she does not know how to be civil when speaking to others. So, there is no reason to speak to anyone like that. Without respect there is no dialog.
          But, talking on here all day gets nothing done, and I will leave the arguing for the individuals who enjoy that kind of thing. I don’t have the time nor the patience.
          I only want to promote true positiveness, and solutions and love hearing stories, or people’s ideas on what to do to stop the KILLING of children, and how to promote safety and a better place in the most poverty stricken areas in this country. Every minute that passes, another horrendous thing is happening to an innocent child.
          Okay, I am off my soap box. Thank-you James for being thoughtful, and kind in all of your responses to me. You don’t have to agree, nor even like what I am saying, but the respect is much apppreciated!
          Carol ;-D

        78. CarolParks says:

          JamesHarvin CarolParks
           Oh, one more thing James, as you can see by this statement below, supposedly by someone that has an education? Once you call someone a name, you have lost all credability, and you have lost the debate. That is the first thing I learned in College, on a debating team.  This person really bullied some of the AA people who were commenting on this site. No doubt he was mad, that I didn’t allow him, to bully me. But, such a statement from an “educated” person. ?? Now how sad is that?
          “You are an idiot…please, stop talking. I will not comment to you anymore and you do me the same favor. A waste of time. ” Chamberslee

        79. JamesHarvin says:

          CarolParks 
           It’s true that some folk let emotions get the best of them, or they cannot tolerate some one putting forth a thoughtful position when they only want to emote.  Then, I’ve known people who just couldn’t tolerate anyone disagreeing with them.  Let’s face it though, name calling doesn’t move the substance of the discussion forward.  i sometime think that’s what they want.

    3. JamesHarvin says:

      ZionMarQuieseDevereaux   So true.  I will never understand why some black folk insist on ignoring the fact that we sometimes make self-destructive and self-defeating decision and action.  Then they always want to confuse criticism of that bad behavior with blame.  Even though racism is and will probably always be an albatross around our necks, that does not give license to suggest that no one should ever say to some black people, “you could make better choices.”

      1. chamberslee says:

        JamesHarvin ZionMarQuieseDevereaux 
        James, your statements are logical and fair, Cosby’s are not. You use words such as “some black people” and “…could make better choices.” Cosby indicts all black people in the lower economic brackets: “these lower middle and poor economic people,” Cosby’s words in 2004. For some reason, that critical point is overlooked. If he spoke as you did, I would agree because some people are problematic in their actions and make poor decisions–as a teen and young adult, I made poor decisions, as well. So no, a lot of people are not upset because someone points out that some black people are not doing their part; a lot of people are upset, however, that  they are being targeted when they do not fit the stereotypes laid out by Cosby and his ilk. Their anger is justified because only a small percentage of lower economic black people actually fit the stereotypes. That is the outrage–that is the point.

        1. JamesHarvin says:

          chamberslee JamesHarvin ZionMarQuieseDevereaux   Chamberslee, that’s just it.  Cosby does talk about a specific part of our community.  If people actually read or heard his statements that would be revealed.  But, when reported that distinction never gets reported as well.
          Consider this story for example.  he simply asked questions about how many parents show up etc.  Isn’t is obvious to anybody that he’s clearly not talking about the parents who do show up?  Of course it is!  Most of us know parents who only go to the school if there’s a problem.  I’ve personally known, and known of, parents who don’t even make certain that their kids do, AND SUBMIT,  their homework.  When Cosby asks, “how many parent show up,” he’s talking to those parents, not to the parents who are involved.  Asking such questions in no way indicts every black parent, that is, if one wants to be fair about it.  Read the New York Post column and you’ll see that not one time did Cosby say anything about all black people.

        2. chamberslee says:

          JamesHarvin chamberslee ZionMarQuieseDevereaux
          James, I have been following Cosby’s tirade since 2004, not just one article on the issue. He does not say in this recent article that lower economic and middle economic people are the problem but he has said it in other statements, ad nauseum, and I do not ignore his premise because it is not stated as clearly in this article. Until he says he no longer believes those lower economic and middle economic people are the problem and gives the issue the complexity it deserves, I will continue to point out his racial stereotypes and over generalizations about certain segments of the black community that are nothing more than right-wing talking points designed to distract from policy issues.

        3. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          JamesHarvin chamberslee ZionMarQuieseDevereaux Some black people have no clue.
          They get offended by the smallest thing but have no qualms about offending others.

    4. chamberslee says:

      ZionMarQuieseDevereaux 
      Of course Cosby is wrong because he uses racial stereotypes, over generalizations and right-wing talking points. Nothing he says about all poor black people, starting in 2004, is valid–some poor blacks, yes; all poor blacks, no. You seem to agree with the premise that people make choices to be poor or struggle with the ills of black society. Read the following and add it to your calendar and lets revisit this matter and see if you feel the same. 
      Bill Moyers, host of PBS: Frontline, is airing a piece on July 9th titled “Two American Families.” Over a 20 year period, it chronicles a white and black family’s economic struggles, as they fall from the middle class–after losing their good paying manufacturing jobs. I watched their early struggles in the 90s and can tell you that no amount of personal responsibility can move a family forward without policy reform when the policies are stacked against them and this 20 year expose will open your eyes and show you that you do not know what you think you know. The conclusion will challenge what many think about personal responsibility being the sole answer to moving the black community forward.  
      Each family did everything possible: retraining, education, worked multiple jobs, cut costs. One husband worked so many hours on his two jobs that he nearly died from exhaustion and had to spend three months in the hospital recovering. One women was told by her boss that her race prevented him from giving her homes to sale in more lucrative neighborhoods, so she could not break through that racial glass ceiling. What about starting their own businesses? 
      Please watch it, on television or online (Frontline).

    5. chamberslee says:

      ZionMarQuieseDevereaux
      Here is a 5 minute snippet on one of the families and where their are 20 years later: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/business-economy-financial-crisis/two-american-families/in-milwaukee-a-familys-struggle-for-survival/

    6. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux Specific instances and examples please..

  63. Jordanl says:

    Old school or new school. Bad grades are bad grades. I respect Mr. Cosby when he said Black males should wear there pants on there waist and complete school. The parents are Responsible for educating,raising,providing for their children. Stop pointing the finger because some of them are pointing at you.

  64. chamberslee says:

    Here is a brief look at a family who has done everything possible, after both parents lost their good paying manufacturing jobs, 20 years ago. The full program will air July 9th on PBS: Frontline. Personal responsibility is not their problem–they have tons of it. They could not overcome policies, however, that have held them back for 20 years. The link is as follows: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/business-economy-financial-crisis/two-american-families/in-milwaukee-a-familys-struggle-for-survival/

    1. whitebl09 says:

      chamberslee This is not a Black problem, this is an American problem. This really has nothing to do with policies either. Although I guess part a small part of this problem is outsourcing but the govt is already trying to do what they can legally to persuade companies to keep jobs here. These are privately run companies that are pretty much free to do as they want. That is also what happens when technology is as advanced as it is today and 1 machine can do the job 5 people used to do plus you don’t have to pay benefits. What do you think that company is going to do. People complain about the jobs we are losing but people subscribe to Netflix everyday and those Redbox machines stay busy. Those things single handedly put Blockbuster out of business. And that’s small scale but you see my point. Sad to say but some people weren’t prepared for it, they thought those manufacturing jobs would be around forever. My dad was one, granted he didn’t have much a choice because his mom died when he was 15 and he wasn’t able to go to college because he had to go to work right away. But he wasn’t at anywhere long enough to retire and the last place he worked laid off all the workers and moved overseas. My pops has no complaints though and doesn’t blame anyone for that and I’m the man in the piece doesn’t either. And if you notice, their son also looks and sounds like and intelligent brother which further goes to the point that you don’t have to have a whole lot to take pride in what you have and strive for more and expect more from yourself and your kids. That’s what personally responsibility is about

      1. bwdn2008 says:

        whitebl09 chamberslee I guess everyone missed the Mortgage meltdown and make no connection between it and corporations. Also Banks like Wells Fargo own Stock in Private Prison. Those Corporations you are talking about are part of Capitalist America which is attempting to faze out black people. My ancestors were slaves, but several were free and fought in the Revolution War, War of 1812, and the Civil War. They fought for freedom for everyone and make no mistake in each war they were fighting against slavery. We don’t learn that in School that many of the Free Blacks who fought in the Revolutionary War, believed that they were fighting to end slavery. The Capitalist System was built on stolen Native Land and African Slaves. That is where it originated and the Manifest Destiny they preached in Colonial America Continues to this day. Your father wanted to work and make a living but the company’s are looking for a profit plain and simple. That is what Capitalism is built off of Free and Cheap Labor. It is a giant pyramid scheme, which collapses, and then looks to taxpayers to shore it up again. That is what happened when Obama decided that some Financial Institutions were, “Too Big Too Fail.”  They handle the loans to businesses and real estate loans. The money Obama gave them was used for overseas investment. Poor Blacks in America and other poor folks, are in the way of progress. In order to fight that evil, you have to know it’s name. There are many people who know they are oppressed, but do not know the root causes and therefore continue to operate in a maze. It is not their fought but someone needs to educate them on what is really going on.

        1. ajamu chaminuka says:

          bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee You got it!

        2. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee Well maybe if they stop going to prison then MAYBE this wouldn’t even be an issue, right?

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee Will maybe if the law was equal some of these crazy whites wouldn’t be free to rape, murder, and maim. They don’t just GO to prison they are overcharged, coerced into plea deals, and given more time for minor crimes than whites get for serious crime. There was a 25 year old white male who raped and assaulted an 11 year old child, and got 5 years. He got out of prison early and raped am murdered two young white women. Another white male kidnapped, beat, and rapped a woman in Nevada, and served 11 years of a 25 year sentence. When he got out he and his wife kidnapped an 11 year old girl and held her hostage for 18 years. That girl had two children by this man while being held captive. During her captivity his (Philip Garrido), Parole Officers dropped by his home and saw these young girls in the house. The neighbors reported him and Police did nothing for 18 years. Why? Because this was a white man and he had done his time. Another white male laid in wait for his ex-wife, beat her and murdered her, while his kids were upstairs. Then he buried her body in the hills and said she ran away and left the children. He finally led them to the body after he was given a plea deal of 25 years for second degree murder. He will be out killing people in about 12 years. This is the news that you do not see because they are all white folks and their victims were all white. The only reason you know about black males is because their negative deeds are all over the news.  You have to do research to learn about some of the things going on in the white community. We also must put aside our self -loathing and hatred of our people. That is exactly where the White Conservatives want you to be.

        4. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux says:

          bwdn2008 ZionMarQuieseDevereaux whitebl09 chamberslee Save the dramatics.
          You are giving me cases that are easily cases of racism.
          So, when you can stop being so emotional and realize that 89% of the issues black people have are because of us then we can go forward.
          Stop with the “everybody hates black males” b.s.
          Have you ever been robbed at gun point by a black male in your own neighborhood?
          Most likely not (even though you’ll properly say you were just to say it) because you would be speaking very differently.

        5. bwdn2008 says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee I am posting that information to the board not just you. No I have not been robbed by gunpoint. But my grandson was murdered in East Oakland and his murder remains unsolved. The so-called white police do not care about our young people being slaughtered in the street. Most of the time they leave their informants out on the streets to continue their murderous rampages. When I pressed them for answers they said I was impeding their investigation. I know people whose children were killed by white police officers in Oakland, not bad kids just kids standing like Trayvon Martin and accosted by Police. So I don’t have the hate for my people or any other people like you believe. My sister-in-law is white and my family is mixed raced from way back. I am not talking about every white person, just those whites who run this society. As much as you defend them there are parts of this country where you dare not go, as a black man, without being shot on site. They have done a good job on you, because you spew hate (like Clarence Thomas), for your own people and love for our oppressor. It is sad but not surprising.

        6. chamberslee says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee
          Zion, I have been a criminologist for about 15 years, a forensic social worker for about three, and have studied the criminal justice system from every facet. Your conclusion has no merit and is quite simplistic. For the past 30 years, even as harsher criminal justice statutes were passed under the Clinton  Administration in 1994, crime rates were declining while the prison population was increasing. In other words, an increase in incarceration rates is not due to an increase in crime rates. A closer examination shows that criminal justice  policies target poor communities, primarily black and brown communities where it is easier to make arrests and get convictions. There are several reasons that makes poor black residents easy targets: 1) less likely to have access to private attorneys, expert witnesses, jury consultants and so on 2) less likely to afford bail or bond 3) more likely to accept a plea deal for previous reasons stated  4) more likely to be incarcerated on a first offense and 5) more likely to receive a longer prison sentence than their white counterparts. 
          Why are the aforementioned facts important to your point? Because prison corporations in the private prison business make billions incarcerating minorities. Following is a copy of a letter one of the most profitable prison corporation sent to each state offering to buy their prisons and manage them for 25 years if the states guaranteed each prison would operate, at a minimum,  at 90% capacity over the 25 year period: http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/ccaletter.pdf.  Lobbyists for private prison corporations ensure laws are passed or stay in place that guarantee a steady flow of prisoners. Mass incarceration in the black community is about profit for corporations not an increasing crime rate. 
          To be clear, there are black criminals who deserve to be in jail, but criminals make up a small percentage of each black community, around 5 to 10 percent. The problem is that the small percentage of offenders tend to be habitual violators.
           If you believe the media, most blacks in poor communities are criminals or have the potential to be be criminals. That is why Trayvon Martin is dead: He was viewed as a threat, as dangerous, by a person who believed the racial stereotype. The truth is that whites are the typical criminal. They use drugs significantly more than blacks (especially marijuana, meth and prescription drugs). A recent report shows that black and whites use marijuana about the same rate but blacks are 3 times more likely than whites to be arrested: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKyitZAQuhA. 
          It is not as simple as it appears.

        7. bwdn2008 says:

          chamberslee ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 There is so much crime amongst whites they have entire networks and shows about them, ID, Snapped, and 48 hours to name a few.  They now have one called Swamp murders, about poor whites in Louisiana killing each other. Yet some of us are so conditioned to believe the worst that we cannot look at the bigger picture. We profile young people who wear saggy pants, but most of the murders in America are not committed by these kids with saggy pants. America is a violent society and our young people are emulating that violence. Why would they be immune from it when even the most wealthy amongst us are prone to violence. Europeans took this country by violence killing Natives for their land enslaving Africans, and that is how America is going to fall, “When you live by the gun you die by the gun!”  I want to focus on getting guns and drugs out of our neighborhoods, and getting our children educated.  I agree with Cosby in that he got the conversation started and we need to follow through on it.

        8. JamesHarvin says:

          chamberslee   So very true.  Justice Department reports under both democratic and republican administrations shoe the blacks recieve harsher penalties than whites. 
          To your other point, just in the last couple years, Pennsylvania juvenile court judges have been involved in schemes to “populate” private juvenile facilities for a kickback.
          It’s so difficult to get some people to believe the institutional schemes designed to harm the black community.

        9. Jose Justino Bronze says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee 
          You must be one of the sickest dramaqueen of an excuse for human being. Sick.
          Are you saying you were robbed because your skin color AND the skin color of the robber. What in the hell is your point Mr. brain?!?
          What is exactly the ‘black peoples problem’ and not a poverty or general greed problem.
          Are you disappointed the robber was black and robbing you and should he rob other races?
          Is that your thinking pattern when you know of white bank robbers robbing a bank with white employees and staff?
          Take a look in your amerikkkan mirror and say your society is not racist and that blacks should stop the drama… AND LISTEN TO YOU SAYING IT.
          JayJBee
          “Sjeeeeees, what a sick disease”

        10. chamberslee says:

          Jose Justino Bronze ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee 
          I am not sure what you are saying, Jose, but you mentioned “blacks” should stop the drama and that blacks are racist. When you make over generalizations, no one listens and we all miss an opportunity to learn from each other. 
          The fact is that racists exist in all societies and communities, among all races: Latinos/as, whites, blacks, Asians and so on. Not all people of a certain race or ethnicity are racist, however. If you think about it, I am sure you agree. I do not believe all whites, all Asians or all Latino/as are racist.  And not all blacks are races, either. 
          As for drama, people have strong feelings they express in ways that are not always understood. Again, that person’s race does not mean ALL persons of that race feel the same or think the same. Blacks are not carbon copies; we are individuals, as I am sure you are. When someone of your race or ethnicity does something stupid, it does not represent all the people of your race or ethnicity. Right?
          Lets learn from each other.

        11. bwdn2008  Thank you

        12. ZionMarQuieseDevereaux You’re not making your case. You can say “89% of the issues black people have are because of us” , but where in God’s name did you get that number? Did you pull it out of thin air?

        13. Jose Justino Bronze says:

          chamberslee Jose Justino Bronze ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 
          Hell no. That was not what I said. Well…
          Put the emphasis on “… and listen to you saying it”. I believe it is insane and you too (tho I only read the first alinea of what you wrote. 
          No, please. I would be the last one to tell our people to shut up about our situation and where it stems from when it gets down to our present part in our global position on ‘the ladder’. In daily life I suffer a lot from what I have learned to call disease because that is exactly the level our self hate has reached a long time ago; You cant tell them anything, but the discussions and other present new means of exchanging experience and ideas will maybe make other readers aware.
          Good to have you on the team. Now going to read the rest of what you wrote and I’ll do my best to take any harsh treatment on me, for being clear to that one ‘brother’ and not to the other readers 😉

        14. Jose Justino Bronze says:

          chamberslee Jose Justino Bronze ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 
          OK. I Read the rest. Not quite what I expected I must say. I agree to disagree.
          There is one race that needs to ‘dust some dust off the shoulders’. Yes, my race needs some time to reconcile its position and the image put on us that has our self-image distorted. And yes, I am one of few of my people who oppose reparation as proposed at the moment. I’d say we black people gently force a mass exodus combined with economical protective laws in name of African autonomous presence on a world market A.S.A.P.
          What is called racism at this point in time is actually (white) supremacy. Racism should be about preservation and since we are all human beings, don’t we, it should be able to accomplish that in a human manner.

        15. chamberslee says:

          Jose Justino Bronze chamberslee ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 
          I agree with some of your premises and disagree with others. All in all, I believe we are closer together in our beliefs and desires than we are apart.

        16. MichaelAkeibaFard says:

          bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee awesome comment!  This is the hidden hand that profits from black misery!  This is the root of White supremacy

        17. JBReal says:

          Jose Justino Bronze ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee I don’t understand where you are getting at with your smug statement sir about drama but clearly we can’t throw rocks living in a glass house. It is very evident that there are many systems In place to makes the lives of blacks more difficult. We are WELL aware of the disparities we face and we don’t need to explain that to you or anyone else for that matter. While just as in each culture, we face some problems which could be attributed to internally, but the US Gov has a far bigger burden to bear for our woes. We don’t ask about the senseless drama at Sandy Hook so keep your sarcasm to yourself if you don’t have anything of value to say. I teach white kids in the school system as well and believe me their situation is as dire as any!

        18. JBReal says:

          ZionMarQuieseDevereaux bwdn2008 whitebl09 chamberslee I agree to the point that we can fix a lot to move forward.

      2. CarolParks says:

        Whitebl09. You are correct. Many people of all colors & white are still experiencing tough times. I really believe it is mainly because of NAFTA, passed by Bill Clinton. All those lost manufacturing jobs has created a mess here in this country, and devastated many cities.

      3. chamberslee says:

        whitebl09 chamberslee 
        I read one sentence in your post, “This is not a black problem, this is an American problem,” and stopped. If you truly believe that rhetoric then there is no need for me to go any further in trying to convince you that the black community has unique problems that cannot be addressed with a trickle-down policy approach, in the same way the Latino community needs specific policy to address its most pressing issue: immigration. Unfortunately, race and class still determine so much of our outcome in America.

        1. CarolParks says:

          Every community, and cultures also; do have unique problems. But, the death of manufacturing in this country has hurt the majority of Americans. Flint, Michigan is a great example of this. Also, Detroit. And many places in this country have become desolate because of the lack of manufacturing. Nothing is replacing it, so now you have to have a degree to get a good job. I really believe the unemployment is high, especially for AA because of the demise of manufacturing.

        2. chamberslee says:

          CarolParks 
          Although manufacturing has affected a vast majority of Americans, white and black, black and brown people have been hit hardest. Manufacturing jobs along with service sector jobs are rebounding in the suburbs–out of the reach of inner city residents who happen to be predominately black. Michael Moore exposed this fact years ago in one of his documentaries. In the documentary, residents had to travel for about two hours one way to work minimum wage jobs in the suburbs. The high paying jobs went to, mostly, suburban residents. Policy is needed to change this trend and bring jobs back to the inner city–and I am not referring to current community revitalization practices that dislocate poor residents from the newly developed community to another poor community where their lives are not improved, as it appears. It is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. 
          Unemployment for white America is a bout 7.4% while it is over 14% in the black community. It is higher if prisoners and those who want to work full time are added.  This is where policy reform is needed and Obama could lead the way. I am not holding my breath, though.

      4. ajamu chaminuka says:

        whitebl09 chamberslee Wow, how naive you are! Sure, you can’t stop progress, so you , the american Citizen and the government have no power to stop american companies from going abroad to exploit slave labor? WRONG! It’s not about policies? WRONG! Your pops has no complaints? Their son is intelligent? Let me point this out to you because it’s obvious your father was victimized as you were by the Mis-education of the Negro Syndrome! The world has always progressed with technological advances, that should be reason to employ MORE people not less because of the wealth accumulation resulting from new ways to do things. It’s just that POLICIES from the wealthy and the capitalist and the government which wealth controls, scheme and conspire to mis-educate and pacify people such as your father and you so that you don’t make demands thinking that it’s all inevitable and there’s nothing you can do . It’s Progress! Personal responsibility? Just look at the people of Brazil, THEY ARE TAKING PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY TO HIT THE STREETS AND DEMAND THEIR JUST DUE! THAT’S WHAT PERSONAL RESPONIBILITY IS ABOUT!

  65. chamberslee says:

    Here is another article that discusses the issues of hard work and and current policies that have made difficult and even impossible for some to avoid poverty or climb out of despair.

  66. BrittGordon says:

    Spitting Rhetoric is not progressive. We are personally responsible however circumstance upon many of us coming from a lower economic background is strike one and then being of an ethnic background is strike two. My personal third strike is being native. He is out of touch regarding truth of responsibility.

    1. MichaelAkeibaFard says:

      BrittGordon Rhetoric (the art of speaking or writing effectively: as. a : the
      study of principles and rules of composition formulated by critics of
      ancient times.) So should he speak and write ineffectively in order to progress?  Do you think Bill has EVIL intentions for the black community.  If not then we may just need to understand his point and ask people that think like him to understand the point of opposition.  Rhetoric is a good thing though

      1. chamberslee says:

        MichaelAkeibaFard BrittGordon
        Rhetoric has another meaning, as well. The definition follows: “Language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect on its audience, but often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful.” Cosby uses rhetoric of that sort. 
        Framing an issue to gain the most amount of support is important. Cosby frames the issues in such a negative way people stop listening. Whether he is correct or not, the people he profess to want to help stop listening. The goal is to gain trust through showing empathy. Instead, he insults an entire category of black people. They feel insulted. I feel insulted.

      2. BrittGordon says:

        MichaelAkeibaFardBrittGordon 
        Rhetoric masks actual truth, so is telling lies progressive? I
        personally think Bill is an Unkle Tom, not evil but a passive sheep
        believing whatever money tells him, to believe. If you think people like
        him would actually listen to any opposing point than your badly
        mistaken and out of touch with reality!

  67. JayRi1 says:

    To be honest I think this author is copping out.  The truth hurts, it is salt in the open wound, it is suppose to make you uncomfortable if your not doing what your suppose to.  The government set conditions not our fate.  Yes it’s tough, yes stuff is unfair.  That doesn’t mean you bow your head and surrender.  Cosby is right, what you go through is 100% on you, as an an individual the trajectory for the rest of your life starts getting formed at around 8 years old, maybe 10.  If your parents don’t get you straight in the paradigm your in, it’s on them who you become.  But at 18, or when you leave high school it’s on you.  Right and wrong are not esoteric concepts, and too many have made something out of nothing to by the we are stuck and f**ked philosophy.

    1. chamberslee says:

      JayRi1 
      Of course Cosby is wrong. He spews the same rhetoric as Rush Limbaugh. In the same fashion as Limbaugh, he relies on racial stereotypes and over generalizations to place all the blame for the problems in the black community on poor blacks, whom he refers to as “these lower economic and middle economic people” (see “Is Bill Cosby Right? Or Has the Black Middle Class Lost Its Mind? by Michael Eric Dyson, 2004).  
      Personal responsibility is important and there are examples of some poor black people not doing their best, not taking advantage of opportunities and waiting for someone to do it for them. That is a fact. But do you believe an entire category of people, lower economic people, is to blame for all of the ills in the black community? Cosby does and has said so repeatedly, starting in 2004. That is why I disagree with Cosby because he does not give the issue the complexity it deserves. 
      As a criminologist, I learned many years ago that things are not always as the media depicts or the person in the room states. For example, most residents in poor black communities are law abiding hardworking residents who want the same things higher economic communities want. Data obtained by the state and federal governments (Uniform Crime Report, for example) show that only 5% to 10% of residents in poor communities commit crimes. Those offenders tend to be young habitual violators which drives up the number of criminal offenses documented in poor communities. The vast majority of residents in poor communities, over 90%, do not commit crimes. Those people take personal responsibility seriously, working multiple jobs, taking whatever job they can, working for minimum wage with no benefits, no pension. They do not take vacations because they cannot afford to miss a day of work. They have one of the hardest jobs there is: being poor. It is 24/7 with no breaks, and few make it out. They can only hope their children can have a better life than they lived. They understand personal responsibility better than most do. 
      Although personal responsibility is important, it can only take you so far before you realize that oppressive policies are hindering your progress. At that point, policy reform is needed to continue that progress. Latinos know this. Gays know this. Women know this. Dr. King knew this, as well. Cosby should admit that we all need help at some point and that does not mean we are note taking personal responsibility. 
      Cosby did not earn a bachelor’s degree but had it bestowed upon him because of his fame. Had he been regular Joe who dropped out of college about three years early, Temple would not have given him a degree for what it called “life experience.” He did not take personal responsibility for earning his education but used his fame instead. Even at the doctorate level he did not take personal responsibility, which resulted in controversy as to whether he attended a single course or did meaningful work on his dissertation.  His fame allowed him to avoid taking full responsibility for earning his education the way the rest of us have to do. The point is that even successful people have help and luck along way, not just hard work.
      July 9th on PBS: Frontline, a documentary titled Two American Families will air. It shows two families who lost their good paying manufacturing jobs 20 years ago and how they applied personal responsibility to stay in the middle class. These families were followed for 20 years. I saw an episode years ago and it certainly gave me perspective. You should watch it and see if Cosby is right.

      1. MichaelAkeibaFard says:

        chambersleeJayRi1 (Of course Cosby is wrong. He spews the same rhetoric as Rush Limbaugh.
        In the same fashion as Limbaugh, he relies on racial stereotypes and
        over generalizations to place all the blame for the problems in the
        black community on poor blacks, whom he refers to as “these lower
        economic and middle economic people)        If all of us are in a circle pattern and the object we are trying to analyze is in the center of the circle it wouldn’t be surprising that we describe the object or the ISSUE a little different based on our view points.  
         The only issues I would highlight in your comment are the idea that Bill Cosby is (TOTALLY) wrong he is not neither are you.  Also unlike Rush Limbaugh I believe that Bill Cosby has the best interest of black people in his heart (my opinion). The fact is wealthy blacks like Bill want to put their money and efforts behind a program or operation that will actually put black people is a better position but they don’t understand exactly how and so they get angry that poor people will waste the effort they don’t view this current generation as worthy (like blacks in the 50’s 60’s).  That is when actors, movies stars and activist teamed up to make revolutions happen.  Also education is best earned in the classroom of LIFE the little doctorate is probably not a high enough level to gauge the REAL LIFE KNOWLEDGE (of his profession) that Bill Cosby could teach and has learned. COULD YOU REALLY put a 24 year old college graduate at the level of accomplishment and experience as BILL COSBY!!

        1. CarolParks says:

          Many people have degrees, but not all of them know how to apply that knowledge to ” real life”. Real life experiences make you who you are, & teach you about “reality”. No book can take the place of experience. Bill Cosby has many programs that he has either started or contributed to for the future of AA children. He doesn’t just talk, he acts.

        2. JBReal says:

          CarolParks I completely agree!

        3. CarolParks says:

          Hi, JBReal! From one woman to another, I would like to say I have really enjoyed reading your post’s on here. 🙂

        4. bwdn2008 says:

          CarolParks Yes you would agree with the blacks who knock other blacks. That reveals a lot about you and your motives for being on this board!

        5. chamberslee says:

          bwdn2008 CarolParks 
          I agree, bwdn2008. The people she agrees with do not care to help poor black people. They have made that clear: They say black people stop asking for handouts and expecting others to help them. The have bought the Rush Limbaugh argument that blacks are responsible for all of their problems and the government has nothing to do with it. They never answer my questions about how we are suppose to stop mass incarceration that has nothing to do with crime rates, education under funding and closings and so forth. Only the government can enact policy that improve those issues. You are right.

      2. JBReal says:

        chamberslee JayRi1 They may not commit the crimes but they cover for the criminals. They may work multiple jobs but the masses spend their earnings (or what’s left) on material things which hold no value other than what is placed in it by the consumer. I work for the school system. I see it everyday. Kids claim they are poor yet they come to school with a new pair of Jordan shoes every couple of months. Not to mention new iPhones, iPads, jewelry, clothes and the likes. They get in trouble and what will the parent do “they uphold the child’s actions and berate the teacher in front of the child. No one seems to have ANY respect for the English language anymore. They are so naïve that they don’t even need it because they see it on TV. They have more faith in a Rapper whom they have never seen in person, than they do a Black Educated teacher or mentor who spends every waking moment with them in efforts to educate them by all means.  So please before you take issue with Mr Cosby, direct your attention to Viacom and the BET network for allowing unacceptable language to appear as normal English. Tell Mr. Rapper to give back to his community in the same manner which Mr Cosby has 9 figures.
        Please call out the ones who are truly responsible for the disintegration of the Black family (after the welfare program). It is HIP HOP and the culture which sustain it.

        1. chamberslee says:

          JBReal chamberslee JayRi1 
          Music is not the reason for the destruction of the black family. Oppressive and repressive policies that have led to mass incarceration for profit, a matrix that justifies under funding and closing public schools in poor communities, incentives that encourage businesses to move to the suburbs where they are out of the reach of those who are desperately  looking for work, gentrification that dislocates poor residents and excludes them from participating in economic opportunities. 
          Similar to rock-n-roll, too much emphasis is placed on music’s affect on youth. Like many forms of art, to some, it is distasteful, insulting and shocking. To others, it is innocent and enjoyable. The vast majority of people are not going to act out the lyrics. If they do, that speaks to their behavioral and mental health. There are far too many factors that interact and compete to conclude that music is to blame for problems in the family.
          If you cannot find a job to house and feed your family, that is going to have a greater impact on the family than rap music or any genre of music for that matter.
          The aging out theory states that as people age and take on more responsibility, having a family, for example, they are less likely to engage in destructive, deviant or criminal behavior. In other words, listening to rap music is a harmless part of human development that most people grew out of or greatly reduce as they age. The youth will be OK.    I grew up listening to rap and I am fine.

        2. JBReal says:

          JBReal JayRi1 You can’t compare  your youth to the youth of today. This is a very different age our children live in today. Unless you are exposed to Teenagers on a daily basis my point is moot to you because you just won’t understand. You don’t see the English papers where they can’t even compose a paragraph because their brains are so saturated with pop garbage and rap speak. That doesn’t translate well into the “real world” unless of course you are Jay-z and even he is well versed. If you don’t work around them then you won’t understand.

        3. bwdn2008 says:

          JBReal chamberslee JayRi1 It is naive of you to post with no historical reference to what is going on in our community. Again, you judge all blacks by the community you live in. I come from a black community in which folks worked and if someone was poor we helped them. We did not publicly insult our own people. Do you hear whites publicly insulting the poor whites who live in Trailer Park. Do you ever see a white person come out and apologize for the Mass Killings done by Whites? So Many Mass Murderers, Serial, and Spree Killers out there that America accepts it as normal. Yet, we are ready to throw our own people away, when they live in desperate conditions and respond in a negatire way. As if they should rise above their circumstances, while those like James Holmes is seen as, “Troubled” by the Media and Courts (after killing and maiming over 26 people.  I can assure you that the rumors of our (AA), demise is greatly exaggerated. There are young AA’s going to college and working as unsung heroes in our community. The media ignores them and focuses on those who are trouble makers. The entire Welfare situation arose after the Civil Rights Movement with the Moynihan Report. Stating that Blacks were having children out of Wedlock and no fathers were present in the household. What he failed to mention was that our young men were sent to the Vietnam War and either killed, or came back affected by PTSD. Sorry but you don’t sound black to me, you seem like someone who is either white or so brainwashed you are out of touch with your blackness. Of course we can disagree with Cosby in this OPEN Forum. He openly criticized his own community and we are openly responding. DAAAH!

        4. JBReal says:

          bwdn2008
          JBReal
           chamberslee
           JayRi1
          Excuse me???Frankly I have the right to say about my culture which I grew up in what I please. And to the point of Historical Reference, I would like to think that as a African American Studies/ Criminal Justice major, I am capable of making an informed opinion about anything regarding my culture. It’s naïve of you to think that you are the only person who are authorized to report on black matters. I am speaking solely from my experiences growing up in the “hood” as well as working in a school system of blacks and whites. I’m appalled that we take issue when we are being critical of each in our own culture for the sake of improving our conditions. Yet we wait on white people who are completely uninformed to weigh in on our struggles. If we can’t be honest with ourselves then who can. Just like Mr. Cosby, I put in work to help our cause. I don’t owe you or anyone any explanation of why I take my position just as I don’t ask your justification for yours. I don’t sound black enough yet you are the one with the white man’s perm–who by the way constantly demeans black women because of this. I am there to hear and see what parents don’t until it is too late. I speak at my local Juvenile Justice Center. I mentor several kids in my community. So madam before you make your red herring comments to escape the reality that there is validity of each of the comments made; I suggest you educate yourself more on the matter with not just attitude and contempt for people who disagree with you. Also, until you can give millions of dollars to educating our youth I suggest you hang back. Also we are not making a sweeping generalization of AA’s as we realize that this would not be an intelligent statements. Sort of like yours.

        5. bwdn2008 says:

          JBReal bwdn2008 chamberslee JayRi1 First let me address something you said which I believe is in reference to my hair. I do not have a perm sir, that is my hair! You are showing your limited exposure by stating that every African American with long straight hair (or wavy), has a perm or weave. I do not have a perm or a weave in my hair. The other point is that you who came on criticizing the blacks you are in contact with, do not want to be criticized or critiqued. We are on an open forum and people are going to disagree with you and with me. So be it! I hope that you are not telling folks to wait until they are millionaires to help their communities. I am very much an activist in my community and go there with a loving spirit. The Activist I work with are diverse, black, white, Hispanic, and Asian, and of many social economic backgrounds. One of my brothers founded a program that helps newly released prisoners find jobs. If you believe the words you spoke about your own people were positive than you I disagree. I thought they were negative and especially of someone in a role model position.

        6. JBReal says:

          bwdn2008 JBReal chamberslee JayRi1 Well you open up the door for these types of comments when you suggest that a person is not White enough. The weave thing is an entirely different conversation all together. If I felt you had to be a millionaire to be helpful then surely I would not be doing my job. Frankly I didn’t need you to approve of my comments and just because they are negative doesn’t make them any less true. I am speaking as a co-conspirator in these matters as I myself am guilty of some of these cultural mishaps. I never claimed to be an outsider. Furthermore if you are embarrassed or angered by seeing my comments on a public forum, then imagine how teachers feel in the classrooms and in the school halls. I wont play tit for tat with you. I respect your POV as well as you as long as you can give me reciprocity. BTW my husband is a former youth court judge which means our kids had a clear advantage in that area of the justice system because he cared about the children in the community and he happened to be black. I do my part but there’s no GAG order on me as black individual to not be openly critical about people not doing theirs.
          P.S. I’m glad you do your due diligence in your community. The need is so much greater than the # of those present to meet them!

        7. chamberslee says:

          JBReal JayRi1 
          I am basing my opinion on my knowledge as a criminologist, clinical social worker, psychotherapist, and addictions specialist. My personal experience is an anecdote but has relevancy.
          I grew up with hip-hop  when it was clean and humorous with the occasional beef between two MCs or rappers (LL Cool J and Cool Moe D) and  was there when the music became more graphic and dark with 2 Live Crew and N.W.A.  I listened to it in cars with so many speakers one could not sit in the back seat. Whatever dumb things I did in my youth was not due to music but my environment. 
          The environment played a greater role in shaping my early behavior and my community’s behavior. It is the Person-in-Environment perspective: What affects the environment affects the person and what affects the person affects the environment. Everything is  connected and interrelated. And then there are systems that affect families and individuals. Certain pockets of communities are suffering from hopelessness, which makes them deep, dark places where some people give up and create their own rules. They become desensitized to the abnormalities and pathologies  that abound. Walking around in public with their pants off their buts as though it is normal is an example. Why? What is going on in the person’s mind. And then you see the community–neglected, rundown, forgotten. This affects the people who live their. There are many factors to consider.

        8. JBReal says:

          chamberslee JBReal JayRi1  Wow if that is the position you take as a professional in your field the I will respect it but STRONGLY disagree. We don’t even agree about an issue at its core so needless to say, this conversation is over.

    2. JayRi1 What “truth” hurts? The idea, pushed by Cosby, that blacks are shiftless folks who’ve brought the world of consequence down upon our heads does hurt, but I don’t think that’s what you’re implying. 
      Parents play a role in a child’s life, but so does public policy and structural racism. Both you and Cosby should stop ignoring that. Parents are just one of many influencers. We should acknowledge that.

      1. MichaelAkeibaFard says:

        Yvette Carnell JayRi1 I will tell you a truth that hurts many of the little “ideologies” individual black folks have all around this country.     The truth is that there is enough history and irrefutable fact available for black people to identify that we have a ENEMY and the primary enemy is NOT EACH OTHER it is WHITE SUPREMACY and whoever and whatever supports it.  Another truth that hurts many people is the FACT that black Americans are still a kidnapped population and WILL NEVER achieve respect or success as a part of the AMERICAN SYSTEM!  American cannot exist without some form of slavery and our part in that system is the SLAVE ROLE!!  THE LAST BIT OF TRUTH THAT HURTS MANY IS THE FACT THAT THE CIVIL RIGHTS PEOPLE AND THE BLACK POWER PEOPLE HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER FOR BLACKS TO BE SUCCESSFUL WE MUST HAVE OUR OWN TERRITORY BUT WE WON’T GET IT WITH GUNS AND A LOT OF VIOLENCE!  WE HAVE TO LISTEN TO LOUIS FARRAKHAN!!

        1. MichaelAkeibaFard Yvette Carnell JayRi1 Farrakhan? The problem I have with Farrakhan is that he shares many of the same ideological penchants as the white right wing. The ‘pull yourself up by your bootstraps’ rhetoric negates the role of government. We should make government work for us in a fair and equitable process. The ‘doing for self’ mantra is a scam to force us to turn away from gov’t… while Wall St. steals us blind. We’ll never have our own country … or whatever. We’re here now.

        2. ajamu chaminuka says:

          MichaelAkeibaFard Yvette Carnell JayRi1 That’s right, listen to Farrakhan, a a man who gives a lot of good speeches but doesn’t do much ‘doing’; A man who assembled 1000,000 hardheads on the mall but didn’t even make a demand of the system. You say we won’t get ‘it’ with guns and violence but how did the man get his territory? A scared nigga is a dangerous nigga! (excuse my french)

        3. JBReal says:

          MichaelAkeibaFard Yvette Carnell JayRi1 I agree. We have to first know what we’re up against before we can address. We also must be honest with ourselves and face our personal cultural faults before we can learn to resolve them. Only after this is accomplished on a grand scale cannot we then go to war to get what we deserve from the government (Not literal War rather proverbial war of policies to benefit our culture).

    3. JBReal says:

      JayRi1My sentiments exactly!

  68. only10ja says:

    “When Bill Cosby’s ready to discuss mass incarceration or college debt, then give me a call. Until then, I don’t have the time nor energy for his unfounded contempt or old man rants”.  Based on this comment I can see the writer is probably a youngster well not too young, sounding off on Bill Cosby’s “old man rant’.  You know what the problem is with the youth?…it is wasted on the youth. Memo to Ms Carnell- it all starts at the home..right there in the home. Stop blaming Government for the ghetto, poverty and all the abysmal happenings of the African american experience. The Govt., is not an alien entity . We put them there. We allow them to screw us royally. But like it or not we are the only ones that will take us out of our experience, no Govt. will do that. So wake up, have a good whiff of reality coffee and leave the ‘old man’ to speak his words of wisdom. Bill has his money and he din’t make it blaming Govt.

    1. only10ja Are you making this discussion about age? Instead of addressing my “youth”, address the issues I raised. Saying you’re an old man or woman really doesn’t win your argument for you. Make your case.

    2. chamberslee says:

      only10ja 
      I do not understand why so many black people have bought this poppycock that the government has nothing to do with some of the issues in the black community such as mass incarceration, college debt, underfunded schools and so forth. Of course it does. And personal responsibility will not change any of the issues I listed. It requires government intervention, policy reform. While you are talking about personal responsibility, other groups are demanding the government enact policy reform and they are having success. 
      Tell me how black people can stop mass incarceration without the help of the government.

      1. JBReal says:

        chamberslee only10ja Simple by taking PERSONAL Responsibility. The Government is an entity that functions on actions. Ms. Carnell, a former employee of Capitol Hill should be well aware of this fact. People in the Ghetto can exact change with their actions. Remember this, The vast majority of housing projects were “Brand Spanking New” when they were built. We created the slums we when stopped putting value in ourselves, our environment, and our families, and began measuring our worth with distorted versions of us on TV. Ironically Mr. Cosby’s show was paramount is the transition to the portrayal that we could better relate to. We vote with each choice we make in the run of a day. The Government does not have an emotion. It functions on “actions” alone.

        1. JBRealchambersleeonly10jaYou’re being far too simplistic, and as a ‘formal Hill staffer, I see that.
          “People in the Ghetto can exact change with their actions.”
          One’s personal actions do play a role, but whether or not you succeed or fail is also defined by your environment and your access to capital. People in the ghetto have far less access to that capital than folks in other areas. That matters. The ghetto is not a product of lazy black folk or too much rap music, it is largely a product of public policy.
          In Chicago, no one wanted to live next to blacks, and, as Ta-Nehisi Coates points out,http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/03/the-ghetto-is-public-policy/274147/
          Once you know and understand this, then you begin to understand how simplistic and woefully biased your argument is. It’s not buttressed on anything but prejudice against poor blacks..

        2. JBReal says:

          Yvette Carnell JBReal chamberslee only10ja But see where you are missing my point is that, I don’t at all disagree that with you that our government is an enemy of our people. What do know is that the condition of our people in the ghetto is often times controlled by the people themselves. This is not a ONEfold (government) problem. It is a multifaceted one in which an intricate web of issues are present. We do our people no favors by coddling them to be victims. We do our people no favors by striking down the REAL leaders of our communities and supporting the FAKERS who lead us down the path of Darkness. I challenge you to write a post that addresses the degree to which the rap culture has influenced our communities at large, particularly our children.

        3. MONTYOG says:

          JBReal Yvette Carnell chamberslee only10ja  Rap started out as a message of unity,, just so you know … mass Media bankrolled the thugs  later

      2. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

        chamberslee only10ja Personal responsibility will change a lot of things.  Its called PROPER PARENTING.  I have seen way too many parents purchase expensive gym shoes and clothes and kids have no school supplies nor food.  thats called  I have low self-esteem and the government can’t fix that.  When people ENCOURAGE their kid to gangbang..thats called crazy…oh, wait…the govt can fix that by giving them a medical card to get some medication…I’m sorry, but my parents and grandparents had way less opportunities that we do…and they had good credit and many, many assets upon death.   My sixth grade education having Dad,  never made excuses…he just talked me how to overcome the system…so did my Grandfather…

        1. JBReal says:

          Andrea Carter Coffer chamberslee only10ja Exactly, many of my students don’t even know how to act like normal human beings because they are raised by parents who want teach them simple etiquette so they learn from BET how to be a man, usually through the eyes of a rapper.

  69. MichaelAkeibaFard says:

    i respect bill cosby he has put his money and his life behind his opinion it doesn’t really matter if he gets everything “right” all the time who does the fact is that he is SINCERE!!  He truly believes in what he is doing and he is NOT doing it for money he ACTUALLY CARES about the health safety and well being of HIS CHILDREN (all black children) .  He has always cared about black people.   He is not a career politician just a man who wants better for us!!!!

    1. CarolParks says:

      MichaelAkeibaFard, Exactly! I agree with you 100% I believe he only wants the best for all the kids out there. He speaks from the heart. He has a lot of experience. It wasn’t easy for him to break into T.V. During the 1960’s. I read about him, & his white co- star at that time wanted all the fame, & didn’t want Cosby to get credit. Cosby is a great example of success!

    2. JamesHarvin says:

      MichaelAkeibaFard  Thank you!  Why some people get in uproar over his statements frustrates me.  Mr. Cosby obviously is not talking about ALL black people in his comments.  Nothing about black people can fairly be said to include ALL of us.  This kind of back and forth clouds the real issues.  Some black people don’t get as involved in their children’s education as they should.  Then some people say he’s stereotyping.  He’s not.  NEVER has he once said all black people do anything.  NOT ONCE.
      This hypersensitivity wastes energy that could best be used elsewhere.  But, we have always had a problem coming together.  Haven’t we.  Opps.  Sorry.  SOME of us have had a problem coming together.  We’d rather fixate on imagined slights rather than see the forest.

      1. chamberslee says:

        JamesHarvin MichaelAkeibaFard 
        No, he never said ALL black people because that would include upper middle class and wealthy blacks and he would never do that. He just included two categories of black people: lower economic and poor economic people. He did not say some or a few but implied ALL by saying over and over “these lower economic and poor economic people.” He grouped ALL people in those economic categories and insulted them in the worst way possible–mocking poor mothers’ whose children have been killed by police, making fun of their names and so forth. Everything I am saying is common knowledge and has been since 2004. You could find the transcript online or read Dr. Dyson’s book where he analyzes Cosby’s statements.

        1. JamesHarvin says:

          chamberslee  I realize that some people believe that the woes of poor people are all attributable to the government.  Some are willing to acknowledge that government only contributes to the problem.  Others believe that regardless of the “fault” government can do more to help poor people.
          As for the latter two groups, it must be conceded that poor people have some control over their lives.  Dr. Cosby only suggests that to whatever degree one has some control over his or her life, SOME poor black people make poor choices.  I believe that you agree with that.

          I never saw, and could not find, any instance where he mocked poor mothers whose children were murdered by police.  I really did look.

        2. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

          chamberslee JamesHarvin MichaelAkeibaFard You quoted Dr. Dyson..Really…He is owed by corporate America.  I love my people too…you have to admit that some of those names..they know better.  How are some of those kids suppose to obtain employment with 7 first names in one.  We do live in America.

        3. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

          JamesHarvin chamberslee Thank you JamesH.  You do have control over your life.  I personally know a young lady born in the inner city to two teenage parents and is in her last year at the no. 1 school in the world for her major.   I know so many of these stories, where people did not focus on WHAT IS but what COULD BE…As long as you complain and look at the problem you will continue to drown.  When we look UP  at the possibilities we will soar.

        4. chamberslee says:

          Andrea Carter Coffer chamberslee JamesHarvin MichaelAkeibaFard 
          Did you read his book? If so, tell me why it should be discredited? Because you do not like a person does not mean the person’s book is not creditable that the findings are not valid. That is a red herring argument. 
          Most import, read the transcript of Cosby’s statements, or do you find that Cosby’s own statements are not creditable. Please…none of Dyson’s works have been questioned on the grounds of credibility concerns. So what is your point? Other than the fat you don’t care for Dyson. Read Cosby’s statements form 2004 and comment on them. I will wait for those responses?

  70. BasiGreen says:

    I agree with Cosby.  Though I think the author has a valid point, but at the end of the day regardless of what the government does or where they channel us to live it’s up to us to help ourselves.  Are we expecting the gov to one day turn a new leaf and start treating everyone equal?  No.  So we have two choices….stay comfortable at the bottom and stay there, therefore allowing the gov to continue to have control over us through those two checks a month and other assistance programs that people in that situation rely on or we can quit crying, pointing fingers, and making excuses and do something to pull ourselves and our offspring out of those situations.  This is all Mr. Cosby is saying. 
    Regardless of who put us here, it’s us that’s keeping us here and the truth is some of us don’t want to leave the lifestyle.  We shouldn’t expect anyone to help us but ourselves.  Once we start doing that the powers that be will see that we actually give a damn about our lives and view us differently as a people.

    1. chamberslee says:

      BasiGreen 
      Why should we not expect the government to enact policy reform for the black community? It is doing so for gays and immigrants. Why not do so for black people? How do we end mass incarceration that is not based on increasing crime rates but policies that target poor black communities so private prison corporations can increase their bottom line without demanding government intervention? How do we improve funding for education and stop the closure of schools in poor communities without government intervention? How do we create jobs in urban areas, secure a livable wage, and forth without government interventions? So many black people have bought this right wing ideology that government is bad and you can do it all yourself. Dr. King understand the need for policy form. Without it, the landmark civil rights laws would not have been possible. 
      Yes, we have to take responsibility and that includes demanding policy reform the way other groups do. That is the only social and political change occurs.

      1. BasiGreen says:

        chamberslee BasiGreen We shouldn’t expect the government to hand policy reform over on a silver platter.  The gays and immigrants situation is apples and oranges compared to ours in my opinion.  That being said they’re putting in the work to get things changed for them, we’re not!  Most of us are sitting back waiting for change to fall in our lap, it ain’t gonna happen.  During the civil rights movement we (Black people) we’re putting in the work and we got change, I don’t see that very much today.  We complain and demand a lot, but where’s the action to go along with it? 
        Schools, crime, jobs….class issue, not race issue.  I attended Chicago Public Schools so I know what it’s like to have teachers that can’t teach because of too many distractions from kids that don’t want or need to be there.  If you have schools that are half full and under performing consistently throwing money at them isn’t going to solve the problem.  They tried that, didn’t work.  All it did was bled the system of funds and made things worse for everyone.   You have to try something different. You can have the best teachers in the world, but if parents don’t get involved in the educating of their children their chance of success is slim.  We need to turn off the tv and sit down at the kitchen table and help them with their homework….don’t wait for report card day, show up on a random day to check up on your kid.  That shows the teachers and your children that you care and they’ll both take things more seriously. 
        I totally agree with you that they’re making laws that target POOR people.  So we need to step up and get things changed.  Couldn’t we also not put ourselves in a position to get arrested at all? 
        I don’t hate government and I don’t think anyone can do it alone.  I believe government is there to give the people a hand up, not a hand out.  I don’t want to get too political but I want to share this….I was in a group conversation where we were discussing a point someone made about Obama not doing anything for Black people.  They said all the White Presidents helped their people out.  I feel that Obama doesn’t have a debt to pay to black people.  He’s the President it’s his job to help everyone.  Granted when party lines are drawn red Presidents are going to help the rich and blue Presidents are going to help the poor and middle class.  Most of the things on Obama’s agenda are designed to help the poor and middle class.  Some people don’t see this because these aren’t hand outs, but things that we need to put forth some effort to take advantage of.  Now I’m not giving the President an A+ grade, but I think he’s at least attempting to get more done than he’s getting credit for….steps off soapbox.

        1. chamberslee says:

          BasiGreen chamberslee 
          I agree. Other groups are putting in the work and demanding action. That is what I have been saying ad nauseum .  Too many blacks feel it is disrespectful to be critical of Obama and that we should not demand anything from him. It is unbelievable. Symbolism appear enough. 
          He is the president and should help everyone but do you see any landmark policy reform he is proposing for the black community. He is working hard for other groups and they are benefiting. Mass incarceration, for example, is destroying entire communities and families and it is not because the majority of poor black people are committing crime.  On the contrary, it is because private prison corporations and other entities are making billions locking up the easiest targets: poor people of color, blacks in particular. 
          Yes, Obama owes the black community because our vote helped him become president. That is how it works. It is working for other groups. But we are our worst enemy: We are satisfied with symbolism. Obama knows it and acts accordingly by ignoring the black community.
          Finally, I am not advocating welfare checks or anything of that nature so there is no issues of a hand out. I am advocating black people pressure the Obama administration for policy reform in key areas that require government intervention, similar to the civil rights moment.  To paraphrase Dr. King, open the door and I will walk through it, a hand up by removing barriers that are impossible to remove without policy intervention. In other words, they are out o the realm of personal responsibility.

        2. ajamu chaminuka says:

          BasiGreen chamberslee It’s interesting how some minds are so brainwashed that they work against their own interests.So you ‘feel’ that Obomber doesn’t have a debt to Black people. So why the hell vote then? It’s his job to help everyone, Then why isn’t he helping the people who gave him 96% of their vote? If there was such a thing as a stupid pill, i’d get you some! Negroes like you are in the way and don’t even realize it!

        3. Andrea Carter Coffer says:

          ajamu chaminuka BasiGreen chamberslee What exactly do you want him to do?  He has enacted policies to make it easier for people to obtain higher education, skills, trades etc.   There was a law in Indiana that provides FREE I SAY FREE PRIVATE school education for people economically disadvantaged.  There are programs in the community to help kids.  We must get out there and help ourselves as well.

    2. ajamu chaminuka says:

      BasiGreen You can’t even see the necessity of becoming ourselves ‘the powers that be’. That’s the difference between being a man and being a slave. Your slavish mentality is a hindrance to Black liberation!

  71. Apoetee says:

    Someone said a long time ago while giving a speech that may not be for everyone: “if it ain’t talking to you, it ain’t talking to you”. When a conductor yells” All aboard”, he is speaking to those who have tickets for that particular train ride and not everyone waiting on the platform.
    If someone said ” Black” women need to stop irresponsibly having kids out of wedlock just because they can produce a child, many would know they are not individually represented in the comment ; however, they care about others who may be contributing to this negative plight being set for future generations, so they are called to action to be part of the solution.

  72. JBReal says:

    “To whom much is given, Much is required.” Mr. Cosby has been very fortunate only because he has put in work. This has allowed him to give back 9 figures, if I might add, to HBCUs our community. He has always been critical of his people but only because he knows our true worth. In my opinion, he is more than qualified to speak freely and candidly on the AA condition as he has walked the walked in conjunction with the talk. He does perpetrate to love and care for black women and go marry a white woman (not that there is anything wrong with that) its to make a point. He has always remained vigilante about us changing our circumstance. Frankly speaking, it is an honor to be chastised from a person whose true intentions are align with your best interests. It is uncomfortable to hear, but then what as of the “Truth” is?” One of the issues we have as the educated black youth is that too often, we dismiss our Elders and take for granted that it was the path of our Elders that created a path for us. Mr. Cosby is a GEM that we should cherish because his caliber of a leader is a rarity In our era. If we as a people are not in a position to hear the truth then we shall remain in neutral. JB

    1. Andrea Carter Coffer says: